Covid tier system.

[TRINITY]

Still not sure if travelling to shoot is illegal. If you read the rules, things you cant do is very clear , it stipulates 'you must not'

Travelling just says advise. If it was an offence ,it would say , you must not travel unless for ...work, caring, medical treatment   etc.

 

[westley]

Well they do not say you can travel. Just that shooting can commence.

View attachment 8454

Thank you for bringing Tiers to my eyes  !

 

[Luke_(NL)]

Wow. Not being on your side of the Channel I hadn't seen any of this. Is the Tier allocation supposed to be up- and downgraded when risks are assessed anew? Weekly? Daily? Tier impossible. 

 

[Robden]

Just copied from the Government website's tier 3 restrictions.

• weddings and funerals can go ahead with restrictions on the number of attendees – 15 people can attend wedding ceremonies, wedding receptions are not allowed, 30 people can attend funeral ceremonies, 15 people can attend linked commemorative events
  
• organised outdoor sport, and physical activity and exercise classes can continue, however higher-risk contact activity should not take place
  
• organised indoor sport, physical activity and exercise classes cannot take place indoors. There are exceptions for indoor disability sport, sport for educational purposes and supervised sport and physical activity for under-18s
  
• you can continue to travel to venues or amenities which are open, but should aim to reduce the number of journeys you make where possible
  
• avoid travelling to other parts of the UK, including for overnight stays other than where necessary, such as for work, education, youth services, to receive medical treatment, or because of caring responsibilities. You can travel through other areas as part of a longer journey
  

 

[jasper]

Wow. Not being on your side of the Channel I hadn't seen any of this. Is the Tier allocation supposed to be up- and downgraded when risks are assessed anew? Weekly? Daily? Tier impossible. 

Clear as mud. Tiers reassessed in two weeks. As you can see from the responses on here some people will read the rules how they want and twist them a little to try and suit themselves with little or no regard for the bigger picture.

The cpsa changed their website statement yesterday to introduce more ambiguity .  It did originally remind people about not traveling into or out of a TIER 3 area unless for the reasons given on gov.uk. Now it doesn't. Maybe they don't know either. Hopeful for some clarification . 

Maybe the picture will become clearer today. 

Jasper

 

[Bebo]

Also copied from the Governments website, but this is from the Tier 2 restrictions:



You can't read the bits you like in isolation, you have to read the whole thing and apply it.  If you live in Tier 2 you shouldn't be travelling into Tier 3 unless it's 'necessary'. You can justify it to yourself however you want, but personally I don't consider that clay shooting falls under any of those examples listed and I'll avoid going into Tier 3 just to go shooting.

If I lived in Tier 3, I'd go to grounds within the Tier 3 area, but I wouldn't travel to grounds in Tier 2.  

It's pretty pointless introducing different Tiers for different areas if people just travel around between them unnecessarily and I personally want to do what little I can to keep my area out of Tier 3 and to help Kent drop down to Tier 2. 

 

[Paul120]

I think it's a bit of common sense. As I said las time. If there are 2 shoots of similar standing (practice/ registered in the same tier  then that should be where you go. If it's a championship in anorthertier then that's a reasonable excuse to go. If not then the championship becomes invalid. If there's no registered in your area then go to the nearest one even if you have to cross the border.  Stick to the rules of where you come from. Eg. Don't go to the pub for a meal in the pub while in the other area if travelling from tier 3 to 2 or 1. 

 

[chesterse]

The whole of Lincolnshire is Tier 3 but the district of South Holland is below the national average and South Kesteven is just above. They have been lumped in with Hull which is 85 miles from us and one of the highest rates in the country. 
So I can go shooting within Tier 3 and go from a low rate area to a high one and possibly get infected but I can’t go from my own low risk area to a Tier 2 where I stand less risk of being infected.

It does not make sense!

 

[Bebo]

The whole of Lincolnshire is Tier 3 but the district of South Holland is below the national average and South Kesteven is just above. They have been lumped in with Hull which is 85 miles from us and one of the highest rates in the country. 
So I can go shooting within Tier 3 and go from a low rate area to a high one and possibly get infected but I can’t go from my own low risk area to a Tier 2 where I stand less risk of being infected.

It does not make sense!

I don't think anyone disagrees that using County boundaries to define the Tiers means that some people are being lumped into Tier 3 unnecessarily.  For example Tunbridge Wells has some of the lowest rates in the country and is closer to East Sussex than it is to Swale (where case rates are really high).

However, none of the measures are about individual risk, so they policy makers don't care if you as an individual get infected.  What they care about are the total number of people infected, as the more people infected the more demand there is for ICU beds and the greater the chance there is hospitals will get overwhelmed and not be able to treat everyone that needs it.  We're all just numbers to politicians and policy makers I'm afraid.

 

[Paul120]

However, none of the measures are about individual risk, so they policy makers don't care if you as an individual get infected.  What they care about are the total number of people infected, as the more people infected the more demand there is for ICU beds and the greater the chance there is hospitals will get overwhelmed and not be able to treat everyone that needs it.  We're all just numbers to politicians and policy makers I'm afraid.

True to a point but in Lancashire in tier 3, Lancaster (97 per 100,000) has it's health service aligned with south cumbria (tier 2) not Burnley which may as well be on the other side of the cou try distance wise at (450+ per 100,000).

 

[Westward]

True to a point but in Lancashire in tier 3, Lancaster (97 per 100,000) has it's health service aligned with south cumbria (tier 2) not Burnley at (450 per 100,000).

There will always be anomalies. We're only in 2 because the Diwali celebrations caused a huge spike in one area of Gloucester about 500 yards square. Luckily it's right next to the hospital.

 

[chesterse]

If they only care about the total number of people being infected then why have they not banned Christmas celebrations this year. One doesn’t have to be a genius to see that there will be a huge spike in Jan/ Feb.

 

[Paul120]

After the track & trace shambles with the Excel spreadsheet (only £22bn) it's probably due to whatever mapping software they have only having county maps and not of Boroughs.

 

[jasper]

Seeing now that some grounds in tier 3 are choosing not to reopen. And some shoots in tier 2 are asking people in tier 3 not to attend their shoots. 

Jasper

 

[Luke_(NL)]

the district of South Holland

I never knew that existed in the UK. Careful, the Dutch are a special type and have in the past annexed what we saw as ours 

Wikipedia tells me the whole district of Holland is copying our style too: Much of the district is low-lying and is kept free from inundation by land drainage. What a coincidence... 

 

[Bebo]

If they only care about the total number of people being infected then why have they not banned Christmas celebrations this year. One doesn’t have to be a genius to see that there will be a huge spike in Jan/ Feb.

Because they know that even if they ban it, lots and lots of people will just ignore it and that it is effectively unenforceable if they do.  It's inevitable that it's going to happen, so they might as well try to gain some goodwill by looking like they are being benevolent.

 

[TRINITY]

Seeing now that some grounds in tier 3 are choosing not to reopen. And some shoots in tier 2 are asking people in tier 3 not to attend their shoots. 

Jasper

Which grounds are these , it could be helpfull to know

Thanks

 

[Bebo]

Which grounds are these , it could be helpfull to know

Thanks

Grange Farm had a post on Facebook that they aren't re-opening yet.  Willow Farm in Kent had planned to re-open, but when they found out they were in Tier 3 they decided to delay it.  I expect there are others, but you'd need to check with each ground before you go.

Oh, and Horne posted that they are starting up again and welcome shooters from Tiers 1 and 2.

 

[FlyingTrotter]

BASC is saying this in the context of game shooting

“Government advice is that you should avoid travel into or out of Tier 3 areas other than where necessary, such as for work, education, youth services, to receive medical treatment, or because of caring responsibilities. Based on current guidance, this is advisory only and not a legal requirement.

However, it is clear the intention of the government’s guidance is to discourage long journeys wherever possible; and we encourage members to consider their individual circumstance before travelling.

If travelling to shoot, you must not leave home if you have Coronavirus symptoms or are self-isolating. At the shoot, you should follow the Covid Code to ensure the safety of yourself and others.”

There is a recognition that the areas are large and therefore the Tiers are unfair on some people that are in more rural areas with lower pop density and lower rates of infection. Just saw BoJo defending the system - if they made it more granular they would have a host of appeals and admin would be too large a factor 

I have some shoots in Tier 3 and I won’t be travelling 200 mile plus from a Tier 2 area to shoot in a Tier 3 area even if I could stay at a hotel in a Tier 2 area near the shoot. My expectation is that the Govt mood music will continue to move against all “unnecessary” travel - with necessity more clearly defined.

There are MPs trying to push back but I can’t see them succeeding 

 

[jasper]

Which grounds are these , it could be helpfull to know

Thanks

Grange Farm had a post on Facebook that they aren't re-opening yet.  Willow Farm in Kent had planned to re-open, but when they found out they were in Tier 3 they decided to delay it.  I expect there are others, but you'd need to check with each ground before you go.

Oh, and Horne posted that they are starting up again and welcome shooters from Tiers 1 and 2.

This.

Jasper.