CPSA RULES

[schmokinn]

At Southdown yesterday for the reg. comp. there was a shooter in a group of new/inexperienced shots i would guess by what they were scoring and the fact he seemed to be teaching/coaching a young girl.

I saw him walk off down the lane carelessly pointing his Red FAC 10+ shot i believe SX3 complete with sling/shoulder strap and no visible breech plug/marker.

Apart from the obvious safety issues i was of the understanding that FAC guns and slings unless for the use of disabled shooters were against the rules?

Mentioned it to a scorer who said the bloke was obviously and idiot but not up to him?

Should these sort of issues not be of more importance for the image of the association than worrying a bouth the name?

 

[Salopian]

Please correct me if I am wrong , but CPSA rules used to forbid the use of slings on guns used in competition . Has this rule been changed?

FAC shotgun certificate holders must have a concession from the Chief Constable to use for clay shooting.

It really is up to us the membership to enforce safety rules , not observe transgressions unchallenged.

 

[schmokinn]

" It really is up to us the membership to enforce safety rules , not observe transgressions unchallenged. " have to disagree in this case it is down to the ground to ensure safe practice and that rules for any competition they put on are observed.

As i said i spoke to a ref/scorer...what do you think the response would be to an individual challenging them? .....i am pretty sure it would be f*** off and mind your own business,i do not fear confrontation but it would be a pointless waste of time for someone with no authority to enforce the rules.

I have many times challenged people about gun safety but it is not up to me to enforce the rules of competition....that is a referees job.

Who am i to question the variations he may or may not have on his licence and how would i know he spoke the truth without actually seeing it?

 

[Rupert]

At Southdown yesterday for the reg. comp. there was a shooter in a group of new/inexperienced shots i would guess by what they were scoring and the fact he seemed to be teaching/coaching a young girl.

I saw him walk off down the lane carelessly pointing his Red FAC 10+ shot i believe SX3 complete with sling/shoulder strap and no visible breech plug/marker.

Apart from the obvious safety issues i was of the understanding that FAC guns and slings unless for the use of disabled shooters were against the rules?

Mentioned it to a scorer who said the bloke was obviously and idiot but not up to him?

Should these sort of issues not be of more importance for the image of the association than worrying a bouth the name?

I bet and from experience if challenged even politely the transgressor will be up in your face and a bad confrontation will follow, how do you feel about standing your ground with an idiot?.

 

[Salopian]

So ! There in hangs the issue. Is it not prudent and your duty of care to not inform the Management / Ground owners of safety issues?

Is it not acceptable to start a conversation with ..........." Excuse me  ! But I believe it is against the Law to use a FAC shotgun for claypigeon shooting unless you have a variation."  or " Did you not know that slings can cause a safety issue whilst clayshooting? "

It is very easy to tuck your head in the sand , but be careful the pellets don't hit you in the arse.

 

[schmokinn]

For the 3rd time i will repeat  that i spoke to a referee/scorer an employee of the ground about it..i have also on many occasions spoken to others about gun safety!

"Is it not acceptable to start a conversation with ..........." Excuse me  ! But I believe it is against the Law to use a FAC shotgun for claypigeon shooting unless you have a variation."  or " Did you not know that slings can cause a safety issue whilst clayshooting? "   no i do not believe it is acceptable to start a conversation questioning the legality of what somebody is doing on private ground without authority.

And as for your last comment it just makes you seem a complete idiot as you do not know me so have no reason to question my integrity....i would have liked to answer in another way but cannot bring myself to get down to your level!

 

[Paul120]

Shouldn't a shoot have a nominated "Range Officer" who is responsible for everyones safety? 

Issues should be reported to that person. 

I don't mind slings on Auto's being used.

I feel safer knowing that it's at least being held vertically with a veiw of the bolt area rather than swung around as they are an awkward thing to carry othewise and I don't believe that closed guns in slips are less likely to be loaded than those being carried and clearly broken. 

 

[paul b]

I saw a man being a tit last year,from the club house at doveridge,he was on a skeet layout,i spoke to a ground official who went straight down there,had a quiet word and lesson learnt the man didn't have to fall ot with anyone he now knows the error of his ways and probably wont do it again,but as a responsible shooters i do feell its the right thing to do if you see anything that looks wrong.

 

[Salopian]

schmokinn,

 For goodness sake take a chill pill or grow a pair . I clearly said "speak to Management / Groundowners " NOT a scorer or referee who will actually be an employee and possibly a young person.

As for lowering yourself to my level , it would probably be very difficult for you to come down from your ivory tower.

Safety is everyone's concern , not to be delegated if you see something unsafe, do something about it before an accident happens, not after.

 

[Rupert]

How old was REF, what was his knowledge on the ruling?

 

[westley]

I bet and from experience if challenged even politely the transgressor will be up in your face and a bad confrontation will follow, how do you feel about standing your ground with an idiot?.

No Problem  !   I would just point out to them that IF they decide to choose violence as their course of action, I would ensure that they had their Certificate revoked, at the same time producing my phone/camera  !

 

[Rupert]

No Problem  !   I would just point out to them that IF they decide to choose violence as their course of action, I would ensure that they had their Certificate revoked, at the same time producing my phone/camera  !

This doesnt seem to deter them, they are just so adamant they are in the right and absolutely the best safest shooter in all the world. It a standard bull ship reaction to being confronted. Experienced this from all kinds Instructors in company jackets one even used "ive shot for england" as his excuse. Doesn't deter me as in quite robust,i talk quiet and let them do the shouting.My fone is in the car.

 

[schmokinn]

How old was REF, what was his knowledge on the ruling?

"Mentioned it to a scorer who said the bloke was obviously and idiot but not up to him? " well respected older professional.

Salopian your condescending sarcastic insinuations may make you think you are clever but pointless really.

 

[Salopian]

Schmokinn,

 I thought you were okay.

Just goes to show how wrong I can be.

 

[schmokinn]

Schmokinn,

 I thought you were okay.

Just goes to show how wrong I can be.

Funny that..i was thinking how easy it is to lose respect for someones opinion.

Never mind,no great loss.

 

[wylye]

Play nicely children................ there's enough anger in this world, we don't need any more.

 

[Salopian]

I could not agree more Wylye.

 

[CharlesP]

Safety, rules, and legality are most certainly things that concern us all. But I have seen the unpleasant response from a transgressor in the fairly recent past. None of us feel comfortable approaching someone who is doing something unsafe or illegal or against the rules, and of course the CPSA should be at the forefront of ensuring that things are done properly.

It's important - massively important - that safety and legality don't find themselves blazed all over newspaper ront pages because some attitude-rich and commonsense poor twit "knows better" than everyone else. That's rather more important than changing the CPSA's name or logo or the colours of its web site.

The CPSA can't be everywhere of course, but they can be seen to be taking the lead, they can suggest formats for prominently displayed safety notices and rules, they can make all clubs aware of what's legal and what's safe, and they can suggest ways of approaching people who are doing it wrong. They can make CPSA affiliation dependant on adherence to good practice, they can act upon reports of problems, and they can monitor.

Ground owners can train their staff, tell them how to defuse a difficult situation, make it plain that all reports of this sort of thing will involve the owners/management, and they can put in place procedures that ensure that intervention.

The CPSA are the governing body of our sport, and it's exactly the sort of thing that they should be doing, rather than putting cosmetic sticking plaster on a wound that might not be bleeding and may not even exist.

 

[Brand New]

As a relative new shooter,it is very important that I am safe and seen to be safe. It is important to me that those around me feel safe. I make sure that the gun is broken before it leaves the slip and I never release the safety catch until the gun is on the target. After I have shot my stand,as club rules demand,I break the gun and show the barrels are empty before putting it in the slip.

  If someone were to approach me and question my safety,I would not react but listen. If I was at all out of order I would hold my hands up and take it as a lesson learned. Thats because I dont have my head up my bottom.