Help - problem with a semi

[PhilS]

Hi Folks,

I own a 1975 Browning B2000 gas semi in great condition.

It is great fun to shoot, especially with the loading port on the left, it makes it easier to load for a lefty!

The problem I have with it is that it will only cycle 28s.  24s & 21s jam every time, if it was only occasionally I wouldn't mind so much.

So, how do I get it to cycle 24s happily without doing any thing drastic to it, or making it so that it will only shoot the lighter load without causing damage to itself?

Bearing in mind I'm no engineer (used to working in wood, not metal, although I can weld).

Over to you guys please....................

Thanks in advance.

Phil

 

[Darkside]

"Problem with a semi..."

VIAGRA!!!

 

[Darkside]

Oh, read the rest now...why not just shoot 28g loads through it then!?!?

 

[PhilS]

I am thinking about going down to 24g in general, so it would be nice if all the guns could use 24s. 

That way I don't have to keep different cartridges for auto/non auto.

 

[PhilS]

"Problem with a semi..."

VIAGRA!!!

Thought that title might prompt a few responses.

And who was first off the mark? 

Nice one Darky, maintaining standards, good man. k:

 

[Fuzrat]

Could be cartridge length, most semis don't like 2 12 inch shells and that is what most light loads are. See if you can find a 2 34 inch 24 gram load and try it.

my auto struggles with jams when using short shells as the mag gate cant close fast enough and it lets 2 sneak through. 2 34 and 3 inch no problem

 

[PhilS]

Could be cartridge length, most semis don't like 2 12 inch shells and that is what most light loads are. See if you can find a 2 34 inch 24 gram load and try it. my auto struggles with jams when using short shells as the mag gate cant close fast enough and it lets 2 sneak through. 2 34 and 3 inch no problem

Cheers for that Fuz,  I'll see what I can find locally.

 

[Outlaw]

My daughter has the same problem with her 20 bore, my mate Ron Berrettaman told me, the gas ports need to be opened up a fraction to allow more gases through to kick the next shell into the chamber, I want it to cycle 21 gram loads and he said it could even do those too. I would only recommend only a qualified person do this though. Speak to your local gunsmith he/she will be able to do it or put you onto someone who could.

 

[Mike]

It's ok to open the ports out but what happens if the gun is sold on?  The bolt will most likely break something in the receiver if the gun is fired with what it's proofed for, as more gas will send it back faster.

 

[Outlaw]

It's ok to open the ports out but what happens if the gun is sold on?  The bolt will most likely break something in the receiver if the gun is fired with what it's proofed for, as more gas will send it back faster.

Thats why I would I would only get someone with the correct skills to do it, a new gas sealing ring on my auto costs £10 and if I sold it on I would fit a new one and tell new owner I have a non standard light weight one to go with it. After all its my responsibilty when selling a gun to make sure its safe.

 

[Mike]

Thats why I would I would only get someone with the correct skills to do it, a new gas sealing ring on my auto costs £10 and if I sold it on I would fit a new one and tell new owner I have a non standard light weight one to go with it. After all its my responsibilty when selling a gun to make sure its safe.

I expect you to be responsible but what if the gun is sold on again and no one knows it's history?

Without going into technicalites it might be classed as being out of proof, as the gun has been designed for what was classed as a "normal" cartridge in thoes days a 32gm load.

If you alter the ports and I know it goes on, just to make these old guns work with a lighter load but in the long run is it worth it?

 

[VicW]

Presumably your B2000 has a recoil spring,probably in the stock.

You could shorten it slightly,trial and error stuff,so that it cycles lighter loads.

Remember,however,the previous warning about putting heavier loads through it afterwards.

Ideally you will need another spring to fit back in if you sell it or want to go back to heavier loads.

I know this idea works because I know a ground owner who did exactly that to his Beretta 303's for use with light loads for instructional purposes.

Vic.

 

[Mike]

Vic,

The spring fits over the magazine tube.

 

[PhilS]

Thanks for the replies so far folks,

the two ideas I think I'll run with first are the internal polish (no remarks) and trying to find a longer cartridge.

the ports on this are two holes in the barrel but I'm not sure about beyond that at the mo.  Need to consult the service manual & get it stripped down when 'the boss' lets me have an afternoon to devote to it.

I'll add to this as and when I make headway/lose ground.

Cheers

Phil

 

[Salopian]

With gas operated auto's you need to work on the gas system .

With recoil operated systems you need to work on the recoil (spring)system.

Cleansing and highly polishing all the moving parts is often very beneficial.

The issue with short shell lengths is that they foul the ejection gate because the new shell is being fed before the old one has cleared the port.

A bit of a think and a bit of patience normally sorts most problems.

 

[PhilS]

Time for an update.

Last night, naff all on tele, I decided to have a go at the offending weapon.

It was stripped and laid out on the table in its relevent sections.

The trigger unit got a thorough cleaning and wipe down then set aside.

Next came the firing pin unit (I'm sure it has a name??) - again quite dirty but cleaned up nicely with a bit of fiddling around with a toothbrush and cleaner spray.  Set this aside with the trigger unit.

The spring got a good clean and joined the other clean bits.

Finally I got to the gas bits.  40 years of crud took one hell of a lot of shifting but shift it did.  The vital surfaces got a good polish using 0000 wire wool, autosol and lots of elbow grease, but eventually you could see your face in them. 

Job done.  All clean and laid out on the table.

Right, time for re-assembly..................  actually it went quite smoothly and I didn't even have one bit left over.  Most unusual, hmmm.

This morning headed down to Cockett Farm to try it, as well as have another crack at DTL.  I quite enjoyed the bit we did at the Growler.

A nice place with a friendly welcome.  Which ever discipline you shot someone buttoned for you.

The good news is that the gun now cycles 24s very well.  Haven't tried 21s but I am delighted that it is happy with 24s.

The DTL went OK I suppose, 17 x 25 for the first attempt using the mirook and then spent a while playing with the semi so didn't really keep scores.  Had a go at their version of the compact, the White Challenge? which was fast & furious and only hit about 17 I think.

Quite tired after that one but stupidly went straight back for a DTL using the semi, which has totally different characteristics to the MK and I hit a miserable 10 x 25.  Shot out I guess.  Didn't help that I was clock watching a bit by then.

But at least the gun works!! :dancer:

So thank you for the suggestions - spot on.

 

[Mike]

40 years of crud, it's a wonder it worked at all.

They were a favourite auto for shooting a flush at a clay shoot years ago, as you could load the gun without taking it from your shoulder.

 

[PhilS]

40 years of crud, it's a wonder it worked at all.

They were a favourite auto for shooting a flush at a clay shoot years ago, as you could load the gun without taking it from your shoulder.

They are handy, you can load from either side, but not from below.

 

[Fuzrat]

Another thought if it is that old, the O ring might be a bit tired as well.(not sure if these have them or not, if so..) Try putting a new O ring on and you might get to 21 gram nirvana little tip with O rings too, put a smear of vasaline on them every now and then, that will stop them drying out and cracking