New Fail to Fire rules

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Had this on Sunday first time ever i never use the safety catch but it must have snagged on the gun slip i was using,pair again first target lost.

how peed of was i!  :cry:

 
Good idea,a ref was nearly killed taking a gun on a misfire ,as he took it it sliped and as the but hit the floor the second shot went off.

 
The only time this happens to me is on the first stand.....gun has been away for a week with the safety on (being safety conscious) and I forget to take it off as I take the gun from its case.

Must remember not to use my safety catch in future  

 
Its good fun to slip the safety on all your mates guns when their not looking. It makes stand one so entertaining.

I've conducted quite a bit of research into this. And my conclusion is that. trap and skeet shooters find this slightly more annoying than sporting shooters.

 
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Like most rules im sure that some will sticking to it like professionals and others will use their common sense.

 
Ive had a few dodgy clicks no bang and I have never been asked by the refs to hand over my gun.  They have always just asked me to open it after  a little wait - some check the cartridge some don't.  I haven't lost a target because of it to date.  First time I wasn't even wiling to open my gun and had Tony take it but that was in the early days.  I think it is better actually for the shooter to handle the gun rather than hand it over for a number of reasons, the best of which was explained above.

 
Ive had a few dodgy clicks no bang and I have never been asked by the refs to hand over my gun.  They have always just asked me to open it after  a little wait - some check the cartridge some don't.  I haven't lost a target because of it to date.  First time I wasn't even wiling to open my gun and had Tony take it but that was in the early days.  I think it is better actually for the shooter to handle the gun rather than hand it over for a number of reasons, the best of which was explained above.
Couldn't agree more the person wearing an England badge on there vest struggled to get out of there chair and move towards the cage,realising that there was no way 2 of us were getting in the cage at once without the likely hood of something going wrong i stated i had left the safety on and they just rolled back into their chair.

Yes i was naffed off but more with the fact that i had made a mistake as rules are rules but a bit with the fact this is someone who i have never seen reffing before who made a decision no other scorer would have done,pretty sure they were a trappy!!! :ph34r: :angel: :wink: .

this was on top of a target i blatantly hit being called a loss and another stand where the cards had been given in the correct order i was focused and ready to shoot and then i had to stop for about five minutes while the scorer corrected all there mistakes after somehow reshuffling the cards and writing the first of our groups scores down for me putting me off completely.

Not a good day for me but i will point out that i did not argue with any of the decisions as wrong or right it is there decision and more often than not they are usually right.

 
I think the reason for this change might be because not all referees are licence holders 
Really? I had no idea you actually had to have a SGC to handle a shotgun. I actually think that if I was a ref I would be more worried about a delayed discharge rather than anything else... and I am told they are as rare as rocking horse shoite still rather not though.

 
so i am on a shoot have a miss fire and have to hand my gun to the ref/scorer!! no offence to any scorers you do a great job and we  couldnt shoot without you all there. but lets face it there are alot of young scores/refs out there just earning some cash on a sunday so i think this rule needs looking at again...

 
If you look at the wording it says the Referee should not take the gun from the shooter!

 
I never understood the ref taking it from you as it seems against any risk assessment to hand over a potentially live gun. But having said that unless the trigger is pulled how do you differentiate between user error or gun malfunction ?

 
As someone who has done quite a bit of (skeet) reffing I still believe that common sense can help. If I hear a loud click on either barrel First or second shot I will not move, will say "I heard that" and call the appropriate outcome. If I hear nothing then I will follow the new rule and walk over, 9 times out of 10 it will be safety on   stand one usually sorts it- happened when I was reffing the shoot off at a British Open- he was sick.

The issue is and always has been for me the shooter not releasing the trigger between shots if I take the gun and it goes off when I pull the trigger no argument, I can see a lot of variables and arguments now, mechanical triggers ejectors that can be turned off etc but as it only happens every so often can't get too wound up. Never enjoyed the handover juggling, particularly when you are pretty certain they have failed to release and it is live.

I understand that someone at the CPSA got their knickers in a twist about junior refs and SGC, I can understand this at some sporting shoots where it seems the "refs" are barely out of nappies earning pocket money.

By the way I think the appropriate thanks for a"mate" who slips your safety catch on is broken fingers- just saying- never put my gun in a rack behind the range since having it done to me, I miss not being able to lock the safety off on my Beretta.

 
Looks like the Health & Safety Police have been at it again :unsure:  

https://www.cpsa.co.uk/news/cpsa-hq/2016/06/08/cpsa-advice-to-referees

I hate it when they change a rule but provide no explanation as to why?

The old rule worked perfectly safely as far as I am concerned so why change it?

Ho hum

DT
Lots of mechanical triggers out there now, so giving the loaded gun to the ref, and he attempts to fire it achieves nothing!  I, as a ref like the new rule, just needs to be managed well.  (Over the five days of the English open sporting, I personally, on my stand had one shooter who had one misfire).

Really? I had no idea you actually had to have a SGC to handle a shotgun. I actually think that if I was a ref I would be more worried about a delayed discharge rather than anything else... and I am told they are as rare as rocking horse shoite still rather not though.
A hangfire (delayed discharge) is actually rarer than rocking horse shoite, you have more chance of winning the new lottery system twice on the bounce!

 
I was taught that in any competition, if my gun failed to fire, after keeping it pointing downrange for around 30 seconds, I then held the gun in my right hand (right handed) pointing skywards, until I received an instruction from the Ref., or he took the gun for examination. On the rare occasion that it has occured, I have followed that advice and it seemed to have worked well enough.

 
I never understood the ref taking it from you as it seems against any risk assessment to hand over a potentially live gun. But having said that unless the trigger is pulled how do you differentiate between user error or gun malfunction ?
easy - just open the gun.  No primer dent and/or ejector action = lost.  Who care about reason?  No boom no kill and no need for the ref to touch the gun

 
yes but what about my recent fault on game gun were tumbler thing wasn't tumbling thus no second barrell. Ref would have had me open gun seen no primer sent and no ejector ejecting and said lost, how would I prove gun malfunction

 

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