Shooting without sgc

[ips]

I totally agree with Sian.

Its ludicrous to allow a unlicensed person and therefore by definition inexperienced to hire a gun and crack on. There is bad enough gun handling from so called experienced folk. I may not be popular for saying it but i think its about time that new licence applications should include formal training in safe gun handling

 

[balltrap]

I totally agree with Sian.

Its ludicrous to allow a unlicensed person and therefore by definition inexperienced to hire a gun and crack on. There is bad enough gun handling from so called experienced folk. I may not be popular for saying it but i think its about time that new licence applications should include formal training in safe gun handling

And who foots the cost of that !

 

[El Spavo]

Its ludicrous to allow a unlicensed person and therefore by definition inexperienced to hire a gun and crack on.

Not being funny, and taking the safety out the question as well, but they're not exactly cheap either: what would stop someone hiring a gun under false pretences on the premise that they're going to pop a few clays on their tod... and then just buggering off with it?!

 

[schmokinn]

Not being funny, and taking the safety out the question as well, but they're not exactly cheap either: what would stop someone hiring a gun under false pretences on the premise that they're going to pop a few clays on their tod... and then just buggering off with it?!

Apparently nothing...bit like giving a learner driver a Ferrrari and saying go for a drive and be careful,don't forget to bring it back!

 

[Kr55tan]

I take it no one knows of any other grounds that do this 

 

[ips]

And who foots the cost of that !

The shooter applying

 

[woody]

I find it utter madness that this practise can happen. 

Last year a guy signed himself into a rifle range that uses an air lock style system to get into the ranges. Even people with their own rifles must pass them into the cage before the doors allow them into the range. He got his hands on the rifle, used a hostage to get the doors released. Less than ten minutes later had killed his ex and her mother. All in sleepy Sussex by the sea. 

I know not everyone is a wannabe executioner, but every possibility should be mitigated to stop things like that ever happening. Letting someone just out on the ground with a club gun beggars belief 

 

[Will Hewland]

I find it utter madness that this practise can happen. 

Last year a guy signed himself into a rifle range that uses an air lock style system to get into the ranges. Even people with their own rifles must pass them into the cage before the doors allow them into the range. He got his hands on the rifle, used a hostage to get the doors released. Less than ten minutes later had killed his ex and her mother. All in sleepy Sussex by the sea. 

I know not everyone is a wannabe executioner, but every possibility should be mitigated to stop things like that ever happening. Letting someone just out on the ground with a club gun beggars belief 

It’s so hard to stop clay shooting practices and some grounds are clearly happy to take the money and pray all is alright. At a registered shoot recently I was behind a bloke using a pump action, complete with sling strap. Uncomfortable to watch, especially on sim pairs. His mate had a conventional gun but was a clueless user. Very distracting.

The other situation I have often seen and hate is the one guy who has a gun, probably bought it last week and just got his certificate, so takes his 4 mates along for a go, all sharing the one gun. The one with the smallest bruise on their shoulder buys the beers later. Makes my toes curl to watch.

 

[schmokinn]

Just been to a charity shoot and the way some people shoot after having a gun for years is scary...my pet hate is people who load the gun and then proceed to move back and lift it over the bar,i have twice seen people blow a hole in the ground an inch or so in front of their foot and several who have hit it on the bar firing a barrel and dropping the gun 

 

[timps]

The section 11(6) exemption is issued by the Chief of police it has recommended guidelines of issue, those guidelines of issue can vary from force to force. You state that you will comply with those guidelines before the exemption is issued.

I know GMP stipulate being supervised, by an authorised person and having to sign a notice that they are not a prohibited person, as do north Yorkshire.

https://northyorkshire.police.uk/what-we-do/licensing/firearms-licensing/section116-exemption-clay/

If the ground doesn’t do as the guidlines state then they will revoke the exemption, I am not too sure on the offence or even if there is one if you don’t follow the guide lines  but the ground will definitely loose its exemption and I know one such ground that did and one that was threatened with it if they didn’t tighten up on procedure.

So it is a possibility Humberside police do it differently to GMP and North Yorkshire as I said in the other thread the exemption rests with the shoot organisers so if they are happy then go for it just don't assume it is the same for all forces.

 

[MartynB]

IMHO, the security side of the rental aspect isn’t such a big deal , let’s be honest , if you wanted to acquire a shotgun “ off ticket “‘ I’m sure we all know grounds where shooters leave them in racks at stands or adjacent to club houses . At most of those places it wouldnt take much for anybody to rock up , take one and  pop it in a car boot . 

I also don’t see much difference between a novice shot without a SGC and a novice shot with a SGC. In fact the worst position again IMHO , which I see quite often,  is a novice SGC holder of a week or two  standing , instructing a mate . 

What would concern me is a shooting ground renting a gun to a novice who can not demonstrate competence in safe gun handling .

If a novice shooter without a SGC  has had a series of lessons with a qualified instructor ,who has said the shooter is safe and the rental is allowable under the ground’s  exemption I think that would be O.K. 

 

[Kr55tan]

IMHO, the security side of the rental aspect isn’t such a big deal , let’s be honest , if you wanted to acquire a shotgun “ off ticket “‘ I’m sure we all know grounds where shooters leave them in racks at stands or adjacent to club houses . At most of those places it wouldnt take much for anybody to rock up , take one and  pop it in a car boot . 

I also don’t see much difference between a novice shot without a SGC and a novice shot with a SGC. In fact the worst position again IMHO , which I see quite often,  is a novice SGC holder of a week or two  standing , instructing a mate . 

What would concern me is a shooting ground renting a gun to a novice who can not demonstrate competence in safe gun handling .

If a novice shooter without a SGC  has had a series of lessons with a qualified instructor ,who has said the shooter is safe and the rental is allowable under the ground’s  exemption I think that would be O.K. 

I couldn't agree more

 

[westley]

All of this criticism is aimed at either the ground or the 'novice' shooter, it MUST be remembered that most of the 'Major' shooting incidents in this Country, were committed by er,............EXPERIENCED SHOOTERS and Licence holders   !  Makes a bit of a mockery of 'compulsory' gun handling courses, for beginners  ?

 

[schmokinn]

All of this criticism is aimed at either the ground or the 'novice' shooter, it MUST be remembered that most of the 'Major' shooting incidents in this Country, were committed by er,............EXPERIENCED SHOOTERS and Licence holders   !  Makes a bit of a mockery of 'compulsory' gun handling courses, for beginners  ?

No really...at least then hopefully they would be pointed in the right direction

 

[Sian]

All of this criticism is aimed at either the ground or the 'novice' shooter, it MUST be remembered that most of the 'Major' shooting incidents in this Country, were committed by er,............EXPERIENCED SHOOTERS and Licence holders   !  Makes a bit of a mockery of 'compulsory' gun handling courses, for beginners  ?

I think any criticism I have would be towards the law rather than anyone else.  Really when you think of it we take a driving test to drive a car so why not to handle a gun?  Cost should not be stated as a barrier after all most spend a fair bit on kit at the beginning and thereafter.  I could think of many so called “experienced” shooters who could do with a refresher course in gun handling.

 

[ips]

I think any criticism I have would be towards the law rather than anyone else.  Really when you think of it we take a driving test to drive a car so why not to handle a gun?  Cost should not be stated as a barrier after all most spend a fair bit on kit at the beginning and thereafter.  I could think of many so called “experienced” shooters who could do with a refresher course in gun handling.

Exactly

 

[Charliedog]

so you can rent a gun, how do you go about getting cartridges (a gift?)

 

[El Spavo]

From a mate with a sgc. Daft really. 

 

[Charliedog]

From a mate with a sgc. Daft really. 

so are you allowed to give somebody without a cert cartridges, i assumed not

 

[Kr55tan]

so are you allowed to give somebody without a cert cartridges, i assumed not

You can purchase them at the ground in question I don't know where the law stands on it but I should imagine it's ok as long as you don't leave the ground with any