Airgun licensing

[ips]

Didnt want to hijack the other post so started a new one. On reading the BASC petition post it got me wondering (again) if the benefits of licensing airguns outweigh the negatives and in fact what are the negatives of licensing airguns if any. so the question is this...........

Should airguns be licensed answer yes or no and a reason why. ?

(I will keep my opinion to myself for a while to allow the post to get going)

 

[lksopener]

Personally i think they should.

Maybe i am speaking from a priviliged postion as i would have no reason not to have a licence granted?

However, my reasons for licensing are simple, regulation limits people of dubvious character obtaining something that could have life thretening consequences misused.

Near me i have seen air rifles sold on markets, fishing shops and in local car boots all of which have no specialist knowledge of guns or firearms.

I would be happy to see airgun regulation. I fear however the demand on our already stretched licensing department may increase wait times unless they establish a specialist department?

Liam

 

[glb868]

My posted moved from the other thread:

Agree to be honest. I don't see any reason why licencing is a bad thing? Maybe a bit of a pain yeah, but there are plenty of people out there i wouldn't trust to hold a spud gun, never mind anything else!

 

[PhilS]

Personally i think they should.

Maybe i am speaking from a priviliged postion as i would have no reason not to have a licence granted?

However, my reasons for licensing are simple, regulation limits people of dubvious character obtaining something that could have life thretening consequences misused.

Near me i have seen air rifles sold on markets, fishing shops and in local car boots all of which have no specialist knowledge of guns or firearms.

I would be happy to see airgun regulation. I fear however the demand on our already stretched licensing department may increase wait times unless they establish a specialist department?

Liam

But the undesirables that you want to keep the guns away from are, more often than not, the criminal fraternity, to whom licensing makes no difference.

They will just obtain a gun through black market avenues.

This said, I too am one who would have absolutely no problem in obtaining a licence for my air rifle, but just don't see that there is anything to gain by making licensing compulsory.

I have also been shot by an air rifle in the hands of an idiot (keeping the thread clean!) but it hasn't/won't change my view.

Phil.

Sent from my Desire HD using tapatalk 2

 

[RobertBeard]

I'm with Phil on this.

Why should all the good guys and gals submit to a whole load of bureaucracy and licence fee when its the criminals who are causing the problem.

if they continue with criminal acts they can be prosecuted under existing law if caught and can be identified.  Possession of an unlicensed airgun is hardly likely to be able to carry a sentence sufficient to be a deterrent.

I think it will be a waste of time and unfair on youngsters trying to take up field target or target shooting in a proper disciplined manner.

 

[ips]

Not showing my hand just yet but.

If youngsters want to take up FT in a propper disciplined manner then they and there parents should have no problem with having to fill a form in and having certain CRB checks done ... Maybe ?

 

[RobertBeard]

As we keep saying it is the good people who are being legislated against all the time.  You cannot legislate against or licence the criminals as they take no notice.

Once licencing is in place and everyone's guns are supposed to be registered then they are a step closer to banning another section of shooting.

What about BB guns, paint guns, bows and arrows, crossbows, catapults, replicas, toys etc?

Its just more and more bureaucracy for the people who behave themselves.

In the case of Dunblane pistols ended up getting banned when it was the police who failed to take action against Hamilton having been tipped off that he was a problem.

Give them an inch and they will take a mile - I'm agin it!

 

[Westward]

I'm against air gun licensing and FWIW I'm against shotgun licensing in it's present form, but I am in favour of basic background check plus safety certification for all users of air gun, firearm or archery equipment which would then allow the individual to own any type of sporting guns, bows etc. Just about the last thing we need is yet another type of certificate.

It's a nonsense that a 16 year old can walk into a sports shop and buy archery equipment that could kill an adult at 200yds, or possibly more, yet we have to be 18+ and have our honesty, integrity and mental health checked out before being able to own a shotgun that wouldn't kill an adult at 20yds.

 

[ips]

Maybe if we are too teach youngsters (probably the biggest users of airguns) the responsibility that goes with gun ownership then maybe some kind of licensing would be a great introduction to responsible adult life and could help there development into adult life in general. I used to fence and was a club coach we were very very strict with the youngsters with regards to safe handing of what are in effect weapons. I strongly believe that the lessons learnt about self control, amongst other things was of great benefit. My point is that discipline, safety and many other life lessons can be instilled at a young age.

 

[RobertBeard]

We have to be 18+ and have our honesty, integrity and mental health checked out before being able to own a shotgun that wouldn't kill an adult at 20yds.

I'm not sure that this statement is correct!

Given the right load, shot and chokes a shotgun can certainly kill at 20 yards and I wouldn't fancy trying it under any circumstances from the receiving end that is!

 

[RobertBeard]

Maybe if we are too teach youngsters (probably the biggest users of airguns) the responsibility that goes with gun ownership then maybe some kind of licensing would be a great introduction to responsible adult life and could help there development into adult life in general. I used to fence and was a club coach we were very very strict with the youngsters with regards to safe handing of what are in effect weapons. I strongly believe that the lessons learnt about self control, amongst other things was of great benefit. My point is that discipline, safety and many other life lessons can be instilled at a young age.

But this already happens in the target shooting environment at the target shooting clubs and the kids are a model of professionalism!

In the same way as we moan about shotgun licence holders who don't behave properly at shooting grounds its the people who don't join a club who are the problem.

Perhaps there should be a competency and safety test that you can only get from shooting clubs which they can charge for when carried out by qualified instructors which would help get some money back into the clubs?

 

[Angelfire]

I'm against air gun licensing and FWIW I'm against shotgun licensing in it's present form, but I am in favour of basic background check plus safety certification for all users of air gun, firearm or archery equipment which would then allow the individual to own any type of sporting guns, bows etc. Just about the last thing we need is yet another type of certificate.

It's a nonsense that a 16 year old can walk into a sports shop and buy archery equipment that could kill an adult at 200yds, or possibly more, yet we have to be 18+ and have our honesty, integrity and mental health checked out before being able to own a shotgun that wouldn't kill an adult at 20yds.

 Aye or a 12ftlb air gun that would not kill you at at 5 paces, unless the pellet had the misfortune to pass through your een. NO NO NO to ANY more certification.

Phil*

 

[ips]

Robert that is a very good point and your suggestion of some kind of training at a club is IMO a great one. If some low life hooligan new if had to do something to get an airgun then maybe it would put him off because of the hassle and just carry on causing fights at football matches instead. It is true that criminal elements will not bother and attempt to get one by other means but surely this is an irrelevant argument otherwise we would not have license requirements for anything.

 

[SteveK]

I'm against air gun licensing and FWIW I'm against shotgun licensing in it's present form, but I am in favour of basic background check plus safety certification for all users of air gun, firearm or archery equipment which would then allow the individual to own any type of sporting guns, bows etc. Just about the last thing we need is yet another type of certificate.

It's a nonsense that a 16 year old can walk into a sports shop and buy archery equipment that could kill an adult at 200yds, or possibly more, yet we have to be 18+ and have our honesty, integrity and mental health checked out before being able to own a shotgun that wouldn't kill an adult at 20yds.

I agree - where will it stop!

My other sport is archery, I shoot a recurve bow and Max, my other half shoots a compound bow. I shoot rounds such as a FITA in which the furthest target is 90 metres away or a York round in which the furthest target is 100 yards and at those distances the arrow still embeds itself into the target by quite a bit and if you miss and hit the target stand, it can be a struggled to get your arrow out.

The reason I mention this is that I shoot at a club and at home, I shoot into the garage to practice my form. All the equipment I buy from specialist archery suppliers, but I have seen very powerful compound bows for sale on ebay and have even seen archery equipment for sale in a national sports retailer.

As far as I am concerned, this may just be the thin end of the wedge. Would controlling of air weapons mean its driven underground and/or toerags, just go out and buy archery equipment?

 

[DoubleBarrelledDon]

Why not demand the licensing of kitchen knives, broom handles, pool cues, super soakers, candlesticks and golf bats, all can cause harm to a greater or lesser degree. If you want to do harm it doesnt really matter what weapon you use, if you have a weapon and all those around you dont then its a bit of a foregone conclusion.... remember, in the land of the blind the one eyed man is king...

 

[Rob C]

No to licensing.......... If anybody really thinks it will benefit the user or users like myself who have been using them nearly all my life with no problems . Then what possible benifits am i going to receive from obtaining a peice of paper to own one.

Punish the minority of  people who misuse them NOT the majority who dont...

 

[ips]

Some interesting points raised.

I would not have a problem with any licence or competency training for airgun ownership, and to be honest I cant see why anyone would have a problem unless they know they could not pass the criteria.

I can not see the benefits of anyone 18yrs old (or whatever it is) being allowed to walk into a sports or fishing shop and purchase an airgun. Furthermore I believe that in the current anti gun climate we as responsible gun owners should embrace legislation that allows us to continue shooting and shows the public and the media that we are quite happy to comply with "certain" H&S requirements (which is effectively what it is) Dunblane is an irrelevent comparison as that was a complete ban, maybe if someone at the time had put forward a strong case about further and tighter legislation both for the shooter and indeed the firearms department then we could have kept that side of the sport in some manner. Sometimes its better to find a compromise rather than dig your heels in and take a stand against any further control measures. Furthermore archery and crossbows were mentioned, so what if they are also licenced what would be the problem.

 

[RobertBeard]

It was divide and rule and nobody then backed the pistol shooters, me included, as I was not a pistol shooter at the time.

We all have to stand together or they will just deal with us piecemeal and leave us nothing in the end, IMHO!!

Les the point about mentioning other things is where is the line going to be drawn and its a serious question?

Take away or restrict air rifles and they will find and use something else to break the law with.

 

[Westward]

I don't think of a licensing system as an infringement of my rights nor do I have anything to hide. My position is simple to define: Design something for shooting like a driving licence which shows that the individual has met certain obvious criteria. The holder could then legally buy and keep any type of sporting gun or bow.

I suppose we are talking about politicians & public sector thinking here so we can't expect anything to be thought through and implemented properly.