B/O Qualification

[tiptop]

OK peeps. Whats your views on qualification for the British open finals? 

It was deemed to be fairer to all shooters to have daily qualifying, due to the changeable weather conditions, and give lower classes the chance to shoot in finals. With this now happening this year is it fairer that people that have shot well are now not in the finals, but people that have shot a lesser score are?

Who/what/when is the decision taken to who stays in class/category now?

Is it right that people from ROW (rest of the world) should take places from "British" shooters, and denying them their chance in the finals?

The results sheet is interesting, and there are still 2 days results to come in.

My view is it may have changed so that people cannot win more than one class/category although they are still initially entered into more than one, but it is now more of a lottery than just the weather if you make it, unless you are a top shot as they seem to get another shot in the senior class.

 

[Darkside]

Much better this way. 

It is the British 'open'...open means anyone can enter and win, if they are good enough!!!

...everyone starting on stand one is the way to go!!!

 

[Hamster]

Sorry but I don't know the criteria and finer points regarding daily qualifications so can't comment sensibly, if and when I can be bothered to familiarise myself properly, then my view will in all likelihood be a bloody good one. 

However, ref the ROW situation I absolutely feel all comers deserve the win even at the expense of denying home shooters a slot, a win is not a win unless you've beaten everyone. I can understand when the US for example has special categories to accommodate non nationals in order that their own main event can only be won by US shots but that seems to be changing now that they don't feel under dire threat from British shooters. 

 

[tiptop]

Much better this way. 

It is the British 'open'...open means anyone can enter and win, if they are good enough!!!

...everyone starting on stand one is the way to go!!!

I know what you mean about it being 'open' and anyone can enter. But it is the "British" title so why are foreign national's in the finals denying British shooters the chance to win in the British open.They cannot take the title can they?? Can they take any medals??? The old way they could enter and take the cash. It just seems wrong to me that people from ROW(if they are not entitled to medals) could deny a British shooter a chance of a class medal by taking their place in a finals. If they can take the title or medals you may as well call it the 'World open' or 'European open'. Maybe the word 'open' needs to be dropped then so it is only the 'British Championship'.

I agree with you about all starting on stand one.

 

[Hamster]

Sorry but the word British shouldn't in itself mean open only to British shooters, how about the US open golf or tennis tournaments ? 

Should Scotts be barred from winning the English Open then ? 

 

[Will Hewland]

Sorry but the word British shouldn't in itself mean open only to British shooters, how about the US open golf or tennis tournaments ? 

Should Scotts be barred from winning the English Open then ? 

Hell yes. And the Welsh. ?

 

[Hamster]

Essex Masters has been won by a Norfolkian has it not ? 

 

[tiptop]

Ok I concede on the naming of the championship and who can win..

But as for the qualification I still think it a big lottery to who gets in. Nobody will convince me that someone that has shot less in a class should be in the finals over someone that has shot more.

And I suppose the class/category thing will always be a problem until they make nomination part of the entry condition.

As long as there is a finals day I think I will refrain from taking part (as I have this year) until it is first past the post again.

 

[Jim Wheeler]

by all the sour comments then, some are not happy because there are 10 or so overseas shooters?well, i don`t think you complain about all the uk shooters winning the africa champs or most other championships all over the world., so uk shooter`s must stay at home? i don`t think so.  ! !

 you might be `honored` that overseas shooter`s bother to spend thousands on coming here to participate. i`m sure the top guns are not intimidated. if your upset, , improve your game, stop moaning, and get a pair.

with the weather and conditions so varied in the UK, i think a shootoff on Sunday is the fairest way to even things up,,,,,,

 

[Will Hewland]

Would it actually be too hard / too controversial to use top scores from all days and ONLY use them from each day if the weather was proven to be a factor? With no rain and no change in wind speed or direction over all days, surely the best scores should count. If the weather went crazy then invoke the scores per day idea. A small committee to decide. 

 

[tiptop]

If its raining ffs buy a brolly :smile:

No sour grapes, as I decided that i would not bother this year when a finals day was announced.

To be honest i would rather take a punt on the weather, than play the lottery of shooting more and not get in, or being dropped out because the CPSA decide to move a category winner in to a class. Have a look at what is going on it turning it into a bit of a joke.

Explain to me how people can win their category on the day and then be moved to a class,surely if you are a category winner you should stay there.

All this sh*te about the weather on different days was all instigated by just a few at the top.

 

[Jim Wheeler]

Would it actually be too hard / too controversial to use top scores from all days and ONLY use them from each day if the weather was proven to be a factor? With no rain and no change in wind speed or direction over all days, surely the best scores should count. If the weather went crazy then invoke the scores per day idea. A small committee to decide. 

Ah,,, form a small committee,,,,,

the weather, whether (!) you like it or not, can have a bearing on proceedings,,,,which ,i imagine, is why it was allowed for this competition,realistically, it can have huge influence. as you well know. a good example is the nad al sheba shoot, where the wind and timing of ranges was a huge factor.

as we know, rules are rules,,,,, take the chance or not.

i dont expect that  `a few at the top` have any influance on the format, or weather, for any shoot. unless you have a fact to backup that ?  tiptop ?

 

[cjc]

The British always used to have a 75 bird final on the Sunday, it's the fairest way, if you are unlucky enough to get a bad weather day with excess rain or worse wind, u won't win, in golf    every body plays on the same day not half on weds and half on sat. Starting on stand 1 is  an improvement everybody's on a level playing field. Having a final day also helps with most people being there for presentations 

 

[Ian Lawrence]

The British always used to have a 75 bird final on the Sunday,

Actually, going a little further back,The British always used to be won with the person who shot the highest score during the competition. A radical concept I know as it didn't allow any manipulation of the qualification criteria. (No, I didn't say "Cheating", but you catch my drift?)

Clearly that didn't suit those that thought they should have 2 bites of the cherry. I expect they are all happy now?

Oh those glory days when you only had to win a competition once!   :notfair: After all, it's not like you have to have a good turn out to add tension for a televised final is it?

Personally I vote with my feet on this debacle and leave it to those that want to squabble over it. I can see you are all enjoying the intricasies of it? 

 

[tiptop]

Ah,,, form a small committee,,,,,

the weather, whether (!) you like it or not, can have a bearing on proceedings,,,,which ,i imagine, is why it was allowed for this competition,realistically, it can have huge influence. as you well know. a good example is the nad al sheba shoot, where the wind and timing of ranges was a huge factor.

as we know, rules are rules,,,,, take the chance or not.

i dont expect that  `a few at the top` have any influance on the format, or weather, for any shoot. unless you have a fact to backup that ?  tiptop ?

Ah set up a small committee

I'm pretty sure the other day a world champion that frequents this site mentioned somewhere that he was part of a 20 strong group that decided on these things for this and maybe future comps.

I may have dreamt this, sure I didn't though.

Anyway there is no point get all up tight over it, because what will be will be.

Ya pays your money, and ya takes your chance, or not as the case may be.

 

[Will Hewland]

There is a jury for the shoot. Use them. There should be clear weather difference (wind or rain change). If it's borderline, do nothing, but catch the stormy day.

 

[Doctor Lecter]

correct me if Im wrong but in effect you have to win the shoot twice ,  and depending on scores  to qualify for the final  someone could shoot a lower score and qualify on a different day .  mmmmmmmmm   not sure I like this system ,  however with my shooting ability it will never affect  me  !   also  I watched the video on English sporting  it looked pretty tough to me .   some excellent shooting / scores in though  .

 

[tiptop]

correct me if Im wrong but in effect you have to win the shoot twice ,  and depending on scores  to qualify for the final  someone could shoot a lower score and qualify on a different day .  mmmmmmmmm   not sure I like this system ,  however with my shooting ability it will never affect  me  !   also  I watched the video on English sporting  it looked pretty tough to me .   some excellent shooting / scores in though  .

Exactly that...and all in the name of fair weather shooters, sorry fairness. :smile:

In effect what you really have now is 4 days of qualifying and a 75 bird championship on the 5th day for the classes, the top 6 guns of the day then shoot another 25 targets,the highest combined score from the 75+25 will be crowned British champion.

 

[Ian Lawrence]

Exactly that...and all in the name of fair weather shooters, sorry fairness. :smile:

In effect what you really have now is 4 days of qualifying and a 75 bird championship on the 5th day for the classes, the top 6 guns of the day then shoot another 25 targets,the highest combined score from the 75+25 will be crowned British champion.

Precisely! Imagine shooting 120 straight in the competition and the next nearest to you might be on 114/115 perhaps. Now that's some shooting is it not?

Then, in the finals, your purple patch is on the slide and someone who scraped into qualiying on maybe, 110 in the competition, comes through to win as overall Champion!

Gutted? Yes, I think you might be!  :???:

As far as "The Committee" deciding how these things go, you only have to have a decent pair of eyes and ears to watch and learn. Personally I have felt many times, the level of fraternisation with the Shoot Organisers/Officials absolutely stinks. Sometimes I wonder if there must be some sort of vote as to who's turn it is to win this year, and how they will get it past the masses without question. You may say that is rubbish, but then maybe you have just not been paying attention?

Clay Shooting really should be a test of shooting skill and nothing else.