How frustrating is this game?

[jwpzx9r]

Last shoot of the season which was in the worst conditions I have seen down here. Any way was shooting UT which I have now shot five times. I usually shoot a high of about twenty and start off with a low score and after another couple of rounds shoot my best score for the day. Yesterday I start with an 18 hmm not to shabby for me and the conditions are very bad I then proceed to shoot 14,17 and 15. I was weirdly enough hitting what you would normally call a harder target, left and right 45 degree with easy and missing the ones that were almost straight away ?? I need a coach for both technique and my head! 

 

[Les53]

John........welcome to the strange world of trap shooting mate!!!!

 

[jwpzx9r]

John........welcome to the strange world of trap shooting mate!!!!

I don't know why, no I think I do know why either yourself or ips would have said those exact words. I do need a coach though and one who can speak good English because I was missing targets that I thought I should have hit, indeed thought I had until it did not break . That tells me I need someone who is watching and knows what I did wrong or am doing wrong!

 

[dyosk]

That is weird i was going to post almost the same thing myself. It was a great sunny day up here in the NE so thought it would be a good day at the OT range.
Started off very erratic, missing 2 straight away birds. Then got better as the rounds went on. My question is, is there a way of warming yourself up to shot before the first round ? I sometimes feel as though it takes a round to loosen up. Which is OK in practise but not at a competition. Is there a method to it or it all about getting your mind totally clear and eyes ready to go from the first bird ?

 

[jwpzx9r]

That is weird i was going to post almost the same thing myself. It was a great sunny day up here in the NE so thought it would be a good day at the OT range. Started off very erratic, missing 2 straight away birds. Then got better as the rounds went on. My question is, is there a way of warming yourself up to shot before the first round ? I sometimes feel as though it takes a round to loosen up. Which is OK in practise but not at a competition. Is there a method to it or it all about getting your mind totally clear and eyes ready to go from the first bird ?

If there is someone give me a shout! For me the odd thing was that anything at a really wide angle I managed to clobber most of the time but fine angled  targets were mostly missed? I'm blaming the weather/light conditions and the fact that in the last round I shot, I shot the first five targets with someone else's gun a Browning Carrega and blasted the first two wide angled targets and then missed the next three! Went back to my own gun and muddled through the round, very badly!

 

[ips]

That is weird i was going to post almost the same thing myself. It was a great sunny day up here in the NE so thought it would be a good day at the OT range.Started off very erratic, missing 2 straight away birds. Then got better as the rounds went on. My question is, is there a way of warming yourself up to shot before the first round ? I sometimes feel as though it takes a round to loosen up. Which is OK in practise but not at a competition. Is there a method to it or it all about getting your mind totally clear and eyes ready to go from the first bird ?

probably many ways john you just have to find what works for you.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

.....

 

[Les53]

I don't know why, no I think I do know why either yourself or ips would have said those exact words. I do need a coach though and one who can speak good English because I was missing targets that I thought I should have hit, indeed thought I had until it did not break . That tells me I need someone who is watching and knows what I did wrong or am doing wrong!

John, surely someone in your local club must know a trap coach? If the coach doesn't speak English maybe you could get someone to translate for you. How come you don't speak French if you live there, it must make life rather difficult mate? I had awful trouble with low straight and low right birds at ABT/OT, still do sometimes. I went off to see Andy Perkins and told him about my problem! At that time Andy, who was a GB trap shooter as well as an instructor at Holland & Holland, watched me miss a few and told me that I was underneath the targets! BUT......I had thought I was over the top of them.....WRONG!!!! With me it was about how much rib I was seeing and the fact that my hold position was wrong. I'm not saying that the same will apply to you of course, because we are all different, but apparently a lot of trap shooters see those low birds as flat, but as we all know, they are not actually flat at all, they are rising, so it's a sort of optical illusion. Anyway mate, I would suggest a good coach and maybe someone with you who speaks good French when you have a lesson.

 

[ips]

Les is (as usual) bang on. Low targets are still rising but you tend not to push through the target for fear of missing above therefore the result is a miss below. This I feel is were a low comb or flat shooting gun pays off as you know you have to shoot at the target and don't get fooled into thinking that the gun shoots high therefore you need to always see the target above the barrel ... no you need to push through even on a low one.

 

[Les53]

Les is (as usual) bang on.

Ian if only that was the case mate!!!!   If it were the case maybe I would not miss so many bloody targets!!!!! :laugh:

 

[ips]

As you know Les knowing stuff and putting it into practice are entirely different things.

I would be much better myself if only I practiced what I preach

 

[Les53]

As you know Les knowing stuff and putting it into practice are entirely different things.

I would be much better myself if only I practiced what I preach

+1 mate!!!!

 

[jwpzx9r]

Les

I do speak a little French but I require a conversation that moves very slowly But you quite correct it does make life a little more difficult. I am sure that I will be able to get some coaching over the winter months at a shooting ground I have heard stays open all year round. I will be able to get around the language barrier providing we talk slowly.

What was interesting on Saturday was on of the regular shooters who is really quite good came over to me at the end of a round and quite briskly told me to mount my gun. I did so and he quite abruptly told me that this is a problem you are holding your gun too near the action end of the forend. He was really quite curt as though he was giving me a telling off! He then said that is the way you hold your gun when shooting sporting not trap.. so that was me told! I actually used to hold my gun that way but have changed a bit and find that I hold a bit further back I did this because I wanted to speed up the movement of my gun. I hold my gun as though I am pointing my index finger down the outside of the forend.  Anyway last night I was watching some world cup trap shooting and all the shooters were adopting his preference so I think I will be reverting to my old gun mount better for pointing but it may slow my gun movement a little.

 

[Les53]

Les

I do speak a little French but I require a conversation that moves very slowly But you quite correct it does make life a little more difficult. I am sure that I will be able to get some coaching over the winter months at a shooting ground I have heard stays open all year round. I will be able to get around the language barrier providing we talk slowly.

What was interesting on Saturday was on of the regular shooters who is really quite good came over to me at the end of a round and quite briskly told me to mount my gun. I did so and he quite abruptly told me that this is a problem you are holding your gun too near the action end of the forend. He was really quite curt as though he was giving me a telling off! He then said that is the way you hold your gun when shooting sporting not trap.. so that was me told! I actually used to hold my gun that way but have changed a bit and find that I hold a bit further back I did this because I wanted to speed up the movement of my gun. I hold my gun as though I am pointing my index finger down the outside of the forend.  Anyway last night I was watching some world cup trap shooting and all the shooters were adopting his preference so I think I will be reverting to my old gun mount better for pointing but it may slow my gun movement a little.

There are as many left hand position in use as there shooters John! If you ever watch some of the worlds top trap shooters you will see that some hold very near or even touching the action, whilst others hold almost at the far end of the forend. I tend to use a fairly close to action position for fast trap, however when I shot DTL I used a grip about half way down the forend, I have quite big hands too which means if I go too far forward my fingers go beyong the forend on some guns! Yes using a grip near the action can increase the speed of swing, however it can also reduce the amount of control one has over that swing. You will also sometimes notice some shooters, particularly Italians, who almost have their nose on the top lever, whilst other have their nose about three/four inches back from that point. You will also note that some trap shooters seem to hold the gun very low in the shoulder, at times it looks like the gun is mounted on their chest, many of those shooters seem to adopt a left hand hold a long way down the forend and may also have their head a long way forward too. At the end of the day it's what works for you as a shooter, none of us are the same mate, it is something to speak to a coach about, he will be able to watch what you do and give advice based on what he sees.

 

[jwpzx9r]

Thanks for the advice Les. Can't help but agree with everything you have said especially about the coaching. On Saturday I was amazed I was missing some of the targets because everything felt and looked right ... but it was not and a good coach would probably have spotted what was wrong straight off. I was left frustrated because I was not aware of what was wrong. Most targets hard left and right were walloped but the subtle fine angled targets were getting away. I think I was treating them as being less angled than they were and was shooting behind them, does not take much does it. The light was really bad and it was raining does this effect your perception of the angle? It is no coincidence that my first round which was in the best light was my best. When normally my first round is not so great and I improve??

 

[ips]

John

you are too hard on yourself mate accept sometimes you will miss for one of many reasons some of which even a coach could not tell you. Bad light will seriously effect your perception and acquisition of the target. Nothing you can do apart from play with lens choice and or hold point. Unless your a complete numpty (not you) practice IMO is more important than a coach. Just watch good shooters and take advice but only from people you trust otherwise you will get to much info. But remember there are many ways to shoot you just have to try things until you settle on something you are comfortable with.

See the target trust your technique

 

[jwpzx9r]

Ian

Yet again you and les are correct ! I have to admit I have a overly scientific approach to things and it is the wrong way to look at it, not everything is linear! I come away from a bad shooting session searching for a reason why I did badly instead of accepting that every time I shoot it will be different, if it was not that way I would not be improving. I think what I have to accept that I will not improve every time I shoot, if it was that simple there would be a lot of very good shooters around and no duffers ! I also know that instead of concentrating only hitting the next target I am sometimes thinking about why I missed the last one, surely not the best approach? I must cut that out you have less chance of hitting the target if you are not concentrating solely on that objective. I will only be shooting one every two weeks over the winter or when the weather is good enough I do not shoot comps so every session is a training stint but I do think I will try to get some coaching. Thanks for the input.

 

[ips]

Spot on john if your analysing the miss you are already in a negative frame of mind we all must live in t.e moment but this is very hard to do. There is nothing wrong with analysing why you missed after the round or even during as long as you can get it out of your mind for the shot. You are an intelligent man and the best person to tell you what you did or didnt do is IMO usually yourself. Sometimes you have to think long and hard away from the ground if you know things are not right. I have altered many things many times but always end up back at my natural technique. I believe we all have one and IMO its best to work with what we do naturally and improve it rather than fight against it

 

[Les53]

John I have met and shot with a great many trap shooters over the years mate and every one of them has bad days, even the top boys! Its actually easier to find out why you are shooting badly than it is to indenify why you shoot well when you do! Sounds odd I know,but it really is true! On those good days everything seems to happen all by itself,almost as if you are on auto pilot, even the trigger seems to be pulled withou a conscious decission on the part of the individual. Great days when they happen,bu not often enough in my case!!!