Humble pie for a happy bunny

[Lloyd]

A three hour session with Ed Solomons righted a lot of wrongs on my recent form. This was also my second time out with the modified stock and I’m definitely getting more comfortable with it.

On some going away and incomer presentations using Gamebore Blue Diamond 28g 7.1/2 Plaswad through 1/2 choke, the targets appeared to vanish, so much so I first thought I’d missed as there were no visual fragment to indicate a broken target .

So... happy bunny.

The humble pie is served up somewhat because I have said before that gun fit in my opinion isn’t the be all and end all, and I still think that, but I do feel at least that the stock modifications have helped. In fact Ed has suggested I try even more cast on and even shorter stock (removed the but pad again) giving me a LoP of 345mm.

I do now see a lot more rib than I ever did, but it’s consistent sight picture now.

And for another slice of pie, I have said before that I couldn’t even tell the difference between 21g and 28g let alone between one brand or model of cartridge. However, I bought a slab of Hull Sporting 100 No: 8 which I felt where a little bit punchy than anything I’d experienced before, so I bought a slab of the Blue Diamond’s and felt they were even smoother than a 21g CompX. Of course this could just be a placebo. Seems to be a very personal experience based subject matter.

I shot (25yard) R-L looper, something which has always been a bit of a problem target for me, so Ed had me shoot 20 targets. I missed 3; unheard of from me, so Ed moved me on to a 45 yard L-R and a 50 yard R-L and returned similar results. All in all a very good day for me. Confidence building. Inspiring. Lots of laughs. Lots of learning.

Some footage courtesy of Ed (alas, no footage of missed targets)

Driven

R-L 50yds

L-R 40-45yds

R-L 25yds

 

[Charliedog]

A three hour session with Ed Solomons righted a lot of wrongs on my recent form. This was also my second time out with the modified stock and I’m definitely getting more comfortable with it.

On some going away and incomer presentations using Gamebore Blue Diamond 28g 7.1/2 Plaswad through 1/2 choke, the targets appeared to vanish, so much so I first thought I’d missed as there were no visual fragment to indicate a broken target .

So... happy bunny.

The humble pie is served up somewhat because I have said before that gun fit in my opinion isn’t the be all and end all, and I still think that, but I do feel at least that the stock modifications have helped. In fact Ed has suggested I try even more cast on and even shorter stock (removed the but pad again) giving me a LoP of 345mm.

I do now see a lot more rib than I ever did, but it’s consistent sight picture now.

And for another slice of pie, I have said before that I couldn’t even tell the difference between 21g and 28g let alone between one brand or model of cartridge. However, I bought a slab of Hull Sporting 100 No: 8 which I felt where a little bit punchy than anything I’d experienced before, so I bought a slab of the Blue Diamond’s and felt they were even smoother than a 21g CompX. Of course this could just be a placebo. Seems to be a very personal experience based subject matter.

I shot (25yard) R-L looper, something which has always been a bit of a problem target for me, so Ed had me shoot 20 targets. I missed 3; unheard of from me, so Ed moved me on to a 45 yard L-R and a 50 yard R-L and returned similar results. All in all a very good day for me. Confidence building. Inspiring. Lots of laughs. Lots of learning.

Some footage courtesy of Ed (alas, no footage of missed targets)

Driven

R-L 50yds

L-R 40-45yds

R-L 25yds

out of interest what of the traditional methods were you using to shoot the targets?

 

[Lloyd]

@Charliedog

Spray ‘n’ pray! 
Well, that’s certainly what I had been doing until Ed put me to work.

Ed is very methodical in his approach to coaching and actively dissuades from trying to take on too much at once. He’s been getting me to use ‘pull away’.

I’m not sure if Ed would encourage me to use anything else as he’d rather my progression be solid and steady. That said, I have never had the impression that Ed is one to hold you back either if he sees it worthwhile pushing you a bit further.

With that said, your question reminds me very much about the current hot topic of pull away. I often find myself behind the bird. Occasionally I’ll find myself in front. Ed has never pulled me up on this to be fair. I have used swing through and maintained; not while Ed has been watching mind you!

I would say that my “pull away” is often gradually creep up on the back of the target (depending on speed of the target of course) and then gradually pull away. I try to keep that as one fluid motion if I can. I feel that if I’m really focused on what I’m doing (Ed is really good at getting me to focus) I can judge the speed and thus gap without havIng to hang on to the clay for any length of time. The caveat to this is that’s what I think I’m doing. I’d bow to others opinions of what they think I’m actually doing. 

I think it’s most easily see on the video of the driven target. There I am maintaining a reasonably steady gap behind the clay, so I am matching the speed and I can see the clay clearly, then gently accelerate to the desired gap. Sort of pull away from behind if that makes sense?


 

 

[DavidJ]

Starting behind the clay is swing through, its a single speed move of the gun.

For pull away you connect with the clay, match its speed for and then increase the gun speed to the kill point. two speeds. 

Here's a good description https://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/gun-shots/2012/07/tips-olympic-shooter-how-hit-crossers/

 

[Lloyd]

Starting behind the clay is swing through, its a single speed move of the gun.

For pull away you connect with the clay, match its speed for and then increase the gun speed to the kill point. two speeds. 

If the barrels are on the clay and matching it’s speed, then accelerate to pull away is two speeds, what if your are behind the clay, the gap is constant and this the speed of the clay and then you accelerate to in front of the clay, this at a second speed. Is that pull away from behind or swing through with two speeds?

 

[DavidJ]

Anything from behind is swing through. I've added a link to a Dan Carlisle explanation above

 

[k80ben]

Swing through in it’s normal form should be a one speed move. Pull away would be 2 speeds !! 
 

these are when applied correctly, 

Dan does things differently due to the lighter USA clay !! 

 

[Richard59]

Swing through in it’s normal form should be a one speed move. Pull away would be 2 speeds !! 
 

these are when applied correctly, 

Dan does things differently due to the lighter USA clay !! 

Different Q, I keep hearing / reading that maintained lead is, er “obsolete”? 

 

[Lloyd]

So... pull away in it’s normal form is two speeds, swing through is one speed. Two speeds from behind is what? pull through swing away?
 

I think maybe shooting is like religion. Everyone has their own unshakable faith and one mans zealot is another mans heretic.

Physics perhaps is more like evolutionist thinking. Based on observations and repeatability.

Taking the maths out of it for the sake of simplicity, it wouldn’t matter if the gun was entirely stationary just so long as the timing of the shot was precisely timed to ensure the lead and the clay collide. That would be some “maintained” right there.

I guess those instructors who advocate, as long as you’re not doing something fundamentally wrong and you’re consistently breaking clays, then does it matter how exactly you execute the move or what you indeed call the move?

I’m going to go for my own ‘method’ and I’m going to call it “swingers maintained pull off” 

To execute this new method, you simply pull out from behind and shoot your load

 

[DavidJ]

Different Q, I keep hearing / reading that maintained lead is, er “obsolete”? 

Maintained isn't obsolete, it's the last choice.

Get on YouTube and subscribe to Ben's channel and you'll find a detailed explanation along with more free info than anyone else is putting out at the moment.

@Lloyd Swing Through 

 

[Charliedog]

In my opinion unless you are shooting slow targets you dont have time to calculate and execute methods discussed, surely in reality most people on these targets are just somehow instinctively getting there gun in the correct position and pulling the trigger. I believe I slice up in front of most targets, never knowingly shot swing through or pull away?

 

[Lloyd]

@DavidJ

Yahweh, Allah, Vishnu, Hesus, Zeus... call it what you will.

Broken clays with - Swingers maintained pull off™

 

[Lloyd]

@Charliedog

The “slice n dice” method. I like it!

You should trade mark that and publish it as the new gospel of clay shooting. 

 

[bisondan]

Different Q, I keep hearing / reading that maintained lead is, er “obsolete”? 

Might be to some but it's well & truly alive in my household.