New call for restrictions on gun ownership

[westley]

Wonko,

Yes, you are correct about the future conduct of the Police, but not without good reason. Having read the news report and the questions that are being asked, I am already getting a whiff of 'no win, no fee' here ! 

 

[PhilS]

I agree with Tink and Westley on this.  

There is a huge degree of sensationalism going on here.  Of course my condolences and thoughts go to the family & friends of the deceased, but it is media hype and will blow over.

The police officers concerned are facing disciplinary action for gross negligence and possibly charges to follow.  The guns were removed after reports as to his behaviour etc and then returned, god knows why?

Had it been done with a kitchen knife, there would no doubt be those campaigning for the banning of sharp implements in the home!!!

 

[Rob C]

Any incidents involving shotguns or rifles is bad news for us users. We have a whole brigade of people who dont understand or care about the use and ownership of guns in this country .

As to the argument that they would use some other method if they did not have a gun does not cut much ice with the majority of people . As household knives, cars, rollerpins, or a lot of things you care to mention are seen as necessities to life but the likes of guns are not. 

While I agree that nothing may happen on the basis of this tragic event it is as they say another nail in our coffin

 

[westley]

The report that I read did not state that they were Police Officers who were being disciplined, do not overlook the fact that more and more F.E.O's are Civilians.

 

[Rosso]

As Surrey police have admitted on the news tonight it has failed on two counts.

Is it not the responsibility of the "Chief officer of police" who has signed and granted the certificate.

 

[DavidJ]

http://news.sky.com/story/1362647/breeder-found-guilty-of-puppy-farm-murders

Latest news report states that a man shot his wife and daughter after they "were giving him sh*t for weeks", i suppose my question around this subject is have any of the "Old and Bold" (no offence intended), noticed a marked difference in the way local constabularies go about issuing licences and revoking them where necessary?

Oh yes, come to County Durham and you'll find any number of people having issues with renewals, they are attempting to force the person seeking renewal to produce the doctors reports themselves if required.

There was a report about it in the last NGO magazine.

 

[HDAV]

Oh yes, come to County Durham and you'll find any number of people having issues with renewals, they are attempting to force the person seeking renewal to produce the doctors reports themselves if required.

There was a report about it in the last NGO magazine.

Not just Durham....It was a tragedy for the victims families, but far more people(approximately double) are killed by drink drivers than guns (legally held and illegally held combined)

Elections are coming so expect political nonsense, oddly the history of firearms law shows us that changing the law regarding firearms ownership has little effect on crime levels. Drug realted crime and mental health treatment (woefully underfunded and swept under the carpet in the UK and most of the western world) are much bigger factors!

 

[schmokinn]

I hate that these kinds of issues are made about gun ownership rather than about male violence. The gun is a red herring. The Counting Dead Women project shows that women are being killed by men all the time, no guns involved.

to counter that i think you will find more men have shot other men by a huge margin...and of course a woman has never shot a man.

The counting dead men project? oh yes there isn't one because we do not feel the need to put it in a gender related way,it is simply just a terrible thing whichever gender one is in no way worse than the other!

on the main point i just cannot understand why the home secretary is calling for tighter gun controls when if her police force had simply followed the rules already in place there would not have been a problem.

same old thing someone else F***s up and we carry the can!

 

[ehb102]

to counter that i think you will find more men have shot other men by a huge margin...and of course a woman has never shot a man.

You're right, in the last fifty plus years, in the UK. So far as I can find from British records and legal professionals in the industry no woman has been prosecuted for murdering anyone with a gun since Ruth Ellis. There was one case last year where the media suggested that a couple shot other people, but there's been no details on who pulled the trigger. However, should one be able to find the occasional exception we can put it in a glass case as a curio.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

You are all talking rot on the woman who has not shot a man bit.

G oooogle does not give you the answers.....all the time. Facts do..!!

We had a case of a wife pole dancing with husbands shotgun.....a few years back....and then shot him whilst he was sat in the arm chair.

She is now in chokey...!! FACT.

 

[RobertBeard]

Regardless of the facts, it is just the excuse that the antis are looking for to have another clamour for the banning of guns whether public, police, civil servants or government.

Just remember that handguns were banned on the back of the police failing to act on reports that Thomas Hamilton was no longer fit to hold firearms which is pretty similar to this case if you think about it.

With an election around the corner I would not put it past labour to try and make some capital by making some sort of promise about it like last time when they immediately banned handguns!

 

[schmokinn]

You're right, in the last fifty plus years, in the UK. So far as I can find from British records and legal professionals in the industry no woman has been prosecuted for murdering anyone with a gun since Ruth Ellis. There was one case last year where the media suggested that a couple shot other people, but there's been no details on who pulled the trigger. However, should one be able to find the occasional exception we can put it in a glass case as a curio.

you ignore the rest of the post to force the gender specific orientation of yours......

now if that was a man you would say he was being sexist!

 

[** Pending Removal **]

P.s. There are also plenty of women banged up for possessing firearms of all sorts that they should not have....true story...trust me....i only deal in facts :wink:

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Regardless of the facts, it is just the excuse that the antis are looking for to have another clamour for the banning of guns whether public, police, civil servants or government.

Just remember that handguns were banned on the back of the police failing to act on reports that Thomas Hamilton was no longer fit to hold firearms which is pretty similar to this case if you think about it.

With an election around the corner I would not put it past labour to try and make some capital by making some sort of promise about it like last time when they immediately banned handguns!

You cannot ignore facts...or the conversation is worthless.

Handgun ban taught the government an expensive lesson.

The various politicos have more on their plates for the Gen Elec ...than taking on legal shotgun or firearms licencing.......bet ya :wink:  ...this being a very big one....

 

[ehb102]

You are all talking rot on the woman who has not shot a man bit.

G oooogle does not give you the answers.....all the time. Facts do..!!

We had a case of a wife pole dancing with husbands shotgun.....a few years back....and then shot him whilst he was sat in the arm chair.

She is now in chokey...!! FACT.

Tink, if you can point me to time and date so I can confirm that in court records or any other similar public record I would be grateful. I have spoken with two UK firearms barristers who didn't mention this case. If I can look the case up in the public record I would be happy to believe what you say. Admittedly I wasn't including accidental shootings in my statistics as they are usually regarded differently.

 

[Bryn12]

Liz I can understand where you are coming from but I would point out that something like 25% of admissions to hospital as a result of domestic violence are male.

I would also propose that female on male Domestic Violence is grossly underreported because of social attitudes and the likely results of coming forward - females can expect to be believed, receive sympathy and all kinds of support, males suffering the same are more likely to receive scepticism and ridicule, loads of 'women's refuges', as far as I know none for men? Domestic Abuse of any kind is abhorrent and society needs to stand up and make the perpetrators pariahs but it needs to be a bit more open eyed and balanced.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Tink, if you can point me to time and date so I can confirm that in court records or any other similar public record I would be grateful. I have spoken with two UK firearms barristers who didn't mention this case. If I can look the case up in the public record I would be happy to believe what you say. Admittedly I wasn't including accidental shootings in my statistics as they are usually regarded differently.

It was listed as murder....happy hunting...!

As for UK firearms barristers who do not know....then all I can say is Ooops..! :laugh:

 

[Irishgunner]

Goooogle pole dancing wife? Im in shock you wouldn't believe what came up, off to confessions now

 

[Wonko the Sane]

Regardless of the facts, it is just the excuse that the antis are looking for to have another clamour for the banning of guns whether public, police, civil servants or government.

Just remember that handguns were banned on the back of the police failing to act on reports that Thomas Hamilton was no longer fit to hold firearms which is pretty similar to this case if you think about it.

With an election around the corner I would not put it past labour to try and make some capital by making some sort of promise about it like last time when they immediately banned handguns!

I can certainly appreciate the attendant issues, but what Robert has to say here is what you should REALLY be concerned with.

Pissing contests among the opposition is what politicians love!  If you people and your reps don't stay focused on an arguable issue then you are doomed.

Well, we're all doomed anyway, but if you play the game a bit better you can put it off longer.  Nothing is more dangerous to politicians than guns in the hands of the public.  No matter what they say, guess who goes under the bus just as soon as that is politically feasible??

You best be working on focusing on the problem instead of bringing up others that don't make you look any better.

just sayin  .....................

 

[HDAV]

If you look at the history of firearms legislation the conservatives have banned more firearms than labour both semi cf rifles (post hungerford) and handguns (post dunblane) banned by conservative home secretaries labour only banned .22 target handguns. Maybe they just got beaten to the punch?

Still legal with good reason but target shooting no longer good reason (Should add for clarification I am referring to pistols)

PS you can have what you want on sect 5 (or A N other exemption) as long as you're chummy enough with the Home secretary.....