Time for change

[Salopian]

Robert, 

It is a sad thing to have to admit, but Nicola and myself and others did warn that the articles were going to be troublesome.

Now we must reap what the Board have sown.

With climate change and article changes maybe clay shooting in England will have lots of similarities to crop growing in Ethiopia.

But we the members must remember one thing, we allowed it to happen.

Or more correctly the membership who cannot be bothered (the vast majority) allowed it to happen.

It speaks volumes for the structure of The Board that if Mr. Jellicoe has resigned ? That The Board voted by a majority to elect someone to post that the membership voted at an AGM to remove!

 

[shootinguru]

:fie:  NO MORE POLITICS!   I just wanna shoot! :crazy:  

 

[Will Hewland]

I actually just do wanna shoot. But.. I get that a large club needs administering with the best interests of the members. So what is the solution? Constantly ask 25,000 people to vote and take an interest? Absolutely no way will that work for many reasons (separate discussion as to why).

Another club of which I am a member had a similar position; worse actually as MAJOR decisions needed making re club assets and future direction. Votes and EGM just caused more confusion really. The club restructured to put in a strong board/ management team that was comprised of enough 'proper members' and 'proper business management' and let's them get on with it, largely leaving the members to just get on with enjoying their membership without the drag of administration.

Apologies as I really haven't studied what is going on with the CPSA management, so if this is also what they are supposed to be doing then it just needs doing better perhaps. It is worth paying a few GOOD business people and a GOOD elected cross section of representitive members to administer it as a team and then let them get on with it. They will more than earn back their remuneration.

Sorry if this is a bit simplistic as I admit I haven't studied the CPSA situation carefully..

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Shoot what.......where..... for how long.......and at what cost....?

I want to know the reason why Mr J resigned his post. Is he now leaving the Board?

I talked with him in depth at EJC with regard to the future of the Association moving forward.....and he seemed excited about his job as chairman.

It beggars belief that you can be rejected by the whole membership and their apathy to keeping you in post.......

and then slide back in as a regional director in a region that has never been known to put up choices for selection.......

after its director conveniently resigned his position after finding himself more work to do........just a short time after the election results were known.

This could all be very cynical ....

Bobby is right.....this is exactly the point that several of us (who have a business brain in our head) recognised could happen with the new articles.

Has the board with this move, shown extreme contempt for the membership....?

Is this a series of coincidences.....or is this a planned manoeuvre....?

What does our 'payed professional' the CEO think of this move of Chairman in such a short time in office....?

If the membership still owned the right to vote for Chairman.....who would be in now..?

So many questions......and so many people who do not care about the answers.....hence you have got what you have got....!

Enjoy.... :laugh:

 

[no.1topdog]

I have a sense of corruption, insider dealing, sensationalism and the resurgence of the old boys brigade which makes for a great conspiracy theory.

I wonder who will play Mr Bobbett when they make the film?   :spiteful:

Seriously, if anybody has any proper alternative to The CPSA which still allows me to shoot the Domestic Major Shoots, even as birds only, then please post it on here. I have no need to compete in classes or have my scores recorded. I just want to shoot for my own pleasure and join like minded people doing the same.

I doubt I will be renewing my membership next year. I feel I need to have confidence and trust in any association to which I belong, and I don't now.  :biggrin:

 

[maddmatt]

There is only one way this can ever get resolved, mass cancellation of members, once the membership gets to a certain level they will have no choice because it will be impossible to run the association on that level of revenue. The biggest obstacle shooting faces in this Country is the shooters, too much apathy, too many with the "I just want to shoot" attitude, well at this rate you won't even be able to do that!!

The Board are a law unto themselves and have been for quite a while, is there an alternative? Of course there is but it would require some serious funding, so until a wealthy benefactor turns up and wants to blow a few hundred thousand pounds I guess we are stick with two options:

1. Keep your membership going (and seeing it increase every year), have your averages recorded, a class assigned to and the opportunity to shoot majors and for England... OR

2. Cancel your membership, join the NCSA for £27 per year including a magazine, record your own averages, careless about your class and still get to the majors, the only thing you would not be able to do is represent England..

DK get yer cheque book, we gonna need it...

 

[no.1topdog]

. The biggest obstacle shooting faces in this Country is the shooters, too much apathy, too many with the "I just want to shoot" attitude, well at this rate you won't even be able to do that!!

1. Keep your membership going (and seeing it increase every year), have your averages recorded, a class assigned to and the opportunity to shoot majors and for England... OR

2. Cancel your membership, join the NCSA for £27 per year including a magazine, record your own averages, careless about your class and still get to the majors, the only thing you would not be able to do is represent England..

As someone who has not been a member for the past 5 years I would like to point out that clay shooting does not cease when you are not in The CPSA! I removed myself from the petty squabbling for a while and it seems nothing has changed over time.

There's plenty of shooting opportunities out there which are enjoyed by many shooters and not a Board Member (or a complaint in most cases) in sight. Not all non-CPSA shoots are straw balers throwing rubbish targets either.

If I feel like it, and that remains to be seen, option 2 sounds favourite so far.  :biggrin:

 

[Salopian]

Seriously, are we actually a moaning bunch of idiots who have nothing better to do with our time?

Is the CPSA broken?

OR should we just shut up and go shooting?

I actually do know many, many members who whilst acknowledging that we have a major issue would never do anything about it.

At the West Midlands AGM at the beginning of the year it was acknowledged that many counties members had no interest in CPSA affairs and that we were struggling to get representation on committees.

Terry Bobbett the then Chair said if that was the case and counties and regional committees ceased to function HQ would take over the assets and administration of regions that could not function.

I am pretty sure we are heading that way.

 

[Salopian]

no.1 topdog,

 Option 2. Seems very favourable.

We need to point out that ground owners will very often accept your money to shoot birds only at many registered shoots.

 

[maddmatt]

Sal - I think you have hit on the root cause, IMO anyway, what the underlying issues are and why we are in this position. County attendance is very poor, shooters cannot be bothered with committees and in some cases empire building, so they don't attend meetings or even participate in County events, this has a knock on effect up the chain and we now have a similar situation with the regional committees, look whats happening with the SW region!

The CPSA will ultimately have to manage regional and county level issues, at that point why would they want to administrate County events at all? It feels like the vast majority of shooters fall in to the "I just want to shoot" category, therefore we see ever decreasing numbers shooting County events, especially in some of the fringe disciplines. I wonder what would happen if you made it compulsory for someone who wanted to represent England (in any discipline), that they must have won their County Title (for that discipline) and made the County Shooting Team? Would that encourage more shooters at County level?

Its all a mystery!

 

[Hotshot100]

Sal - I think you have hit on the root cause, IMO anyway, what the underlying issues are and why we are in this position. County attendance is very poor, shooters cannot be bothered with committees and in some cases empire building, so they don't attend meetings or even participate in County events, this has a knock on effect up the chain and we now have a similar situation with the regional committees, look whats happening with the SW region!

The CPSA will ultimately have to manage regional and county level issues, at that point why would they want to administrate County events at all? It feels like the vast majority of shooters fall in to the "I just want to shoot" category, therefore we see ever decreasing numbers shooting County events, especially in some of the fringe disciplines. I wonder what would happen if you made it compulsory for someone who wanted to represent England (in any discipline), that they must have won their County Title (for that discipline) and made the County Shooting Team? Would that encourage more shooters at County level?

Its all a mystery!

Very true Matt, Kent struggled to form a committee this year and I doubt that it will be any easier next year. Our attendances at County Championships this year have actually been higher than for several years mainly because most of the trap disciplines are now being held at Dartford so have attracted a lot of Sporting shooters.

We have changed the way that county teams and the 'shooter of the year' are chosen so as to give more members the opportunity to win something or to represent the county. It also rewards the people that give the county the most support.

As to the 'Bobbett' thing I don't agree with what has happened, however the only people to blame are the members in the South West for not standing against him. It is this total lack of interest by the majority of the membership that allows the powers to be to do whatever they like. Kent no longer has any representatives at Regional level, the committee works purely for the benefit of the counties shooters and it seems to be working well.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Hi RichardW1234.....I noticed you are reading this....could i ask what the reaction is at HQ to Mr Jellicoe's resignation and Mr Bobbetts reappointment. Is there a reason for the resignation that you know of?

It is all very confusing. I presume that you would be allowed to have a view either private or official.

 

[no.1topdog]

Interesting isn't it, that people employed at The CPSA, or strongly associated with The CPSA are also members on this forum, and are clearly keeping an eye on what is being said here, but none of them comment, and still nothing changes as far as I know.

Every time I have made comment in the 6 months or so regarding The CPSA, a representative (who I shall not name to protect their innocence) has viewed my profile on here, presumably to check who I am? Yes, it has happened again today.

When I stopped paying my membership fee 5 years ago, I received not a single communication from the association regarding my reasons for not re-joining. It may have been an oversight on my behalf, or I may have had a grievence, but nobody was interested in me then.

Regarding the comments I have made on this post I would have expected a representative, or an interested party, to have countered my comments and explained the situation to me/us, as I am clearly a floating voter at the moment and may only need a little prompting to continue with my membership. A PM would be acceptable if they were reluctant to speak on open forum and would remain confidential between us.

I really don't think The CPSA can afford to lose many more members right now. Perhaps my membership fee is not important to the association, in which case I apologise for wasting the time it has taken for them to read this.  :biggrin:

 

[Jan Powell]

Reading the many comments about how poor the English open organisation was, how poor the administration by the CPSA at the Worlds at EJC. How CPSA Board function is basically an old pals meeting place and the really poor state our sport is descending into . Is it not now time for change or are we just going to muddle along as we have done for a good many years now?

There is a situation now where we the competitors are being served up very poor events every time the CPSA is involved.

But the staff who represent the CPSA at events are always pleasant, helpful and efficient, so it has to be down to lack of leadership and lack of guidance , knowledge and interest at the top. So how long can this continue?

People have very short memories, but can you remember the fiasco at the British at Fauxdegla, Doveridge , now the Worlds and English. The rot needs to be stopped NOW.

We've been saying that for years!!! Blame the 95% who 'just want to shoot'.

We have the power to change things for the better but only a tiny minority have the motivation to attempt it and many of those eventually give up, broken by the arrogance of the board and the apathy of their fellow shooters.

There are times when i'm embarresed to call myself a member.

 

[Salopian]

RichardW1234,

 Could you confirm or deny that David Jellicoe has resigned as Chair and that Terry Bobbett is now the Chair please?

If not could you please tell us when the latest Board minutes will be made public and available to the membership.

 

[Will Hewland]

It's on the CPSA homepage peter..

 

[Salopian]

Clever, Thank you for your prompt reply.

 

[Salopian]

Just read the announcement. 

Lunatics

Asylum

Fred Carno.

All spring to mind

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Dont wait for the minutes...it will be in the confidential minutes....and we do not see those.

The sanitised version is all we will see.

If 'work commitments' are the reason :laugh: :laugh: then are we to expect the Admiral to resign the board as well......oh ho...i dooooooooooont thiiiiiink soooooo :laugh:

 

[Miranda]

As a recent ex-employee of the CPSA, it comes as NO surprise to me that Terry is back as Chairman. Personally, i do not believe that Dave Jellicoe would have relinquished the role of Chairman willingly. I would not have got good odds at a bookies. I also tend to agree with Nicola that Dave will still be at every Board meeting. This is, of course, my own personal opinion.