S.Deaville
Well-known member
A quick question Hull Pro one the Fibre version of this is Hull Pro Fibre?
Cheers
Cheers
Touchy subject - covered many times (like an old horse!) Cartridges
- Thread starter Growl
- Start date
Help Support Clay, Trap, Skeet Shooting Forum:
EdSolomons
Well-known member
P
** Pending Removal **
Guest
I have used them all over the last 28 years. Brands from UK and many of the oversea makes that you do not get here.
There is.......without a shadow of a doubt..........definite differences between shells........and definite differences between performance of 'club shells' to top end shells.
A 'club cartridge' has never won a World or European.
It is however Horses for courses........shoot what you can afford for the type of shooting you do.......and get as much enjoyment as you can.
Head game can come into it with some people .........but.........To say that the top range of each brand is just marketing is naive in the extreme......it is like putting a mini, a roller and a porche in the same race.....there is only going to be one winner. :laugh:
So many people take the piss on here it is getting so hard now to see 'daylight at the end of the road that leads to nowhere' :laugh:
Shoot what you are happy with.......everyone does.........and I will put money on it that Ed will not be using cheap as chips cartridges in a shoot off with Ben or George for any world title........ : laugh:
You can lead a horse to water campers.......but you cannot make it drink.......true story.!!
There is.......without a shadow of a doubt..........definite differences between shells........and definite differences between performance of 'club shells' to top end shells.
A 'club cartridge' has never won a World or European.
It is however Horses for courses........shoot what you can afford for the type of shooting you do.......and get as much enjoyment as you can.
Head game can come into it with some people .........but.........To say that the top range of each brand is just marketing is naive in the extreme......it is like putting a mini, a roller and a porche in the same race.....there is only going to be one winner. :laugh:
So many people take the piss on here it is getting so hard now to see 'daylight at the end of the road that leads to nowhere' :laugh:
Shoot what you are happy with.......everyone does.........and I will put money on it that Ed will not be using cheap as chips cartridges in a shoot off with Ben or George for any world title........ : laugh:
You can lead a horse to water campers.......but you cannot make it drink.......true story.!!
Will Hewland
Well-known member
You are right Nicola. And some cartridges are fairly bad..
What I must say though, is that there is NOT a perfect correlation between price and performance across all brands. (I.e. 'a dearer shell must be better' is not a solid fact) And as all engineers know, design is partly opinion.
What I am saying is that the devil is in the detail and my personal quest is to find cartridges that do all the things that are really needed without getting to the 'unnecessary' stage of performance or price.
I concede that if I were a trap shooter I would focus on cartridges in a more consistent way and the science could escalate for me. Sporting does allow opinion and myth to exist a bit more..
What I must say though, is that there is NOT a perfect correlation between price and performance across all brands. (I.e. 'a dearer shell must be better' is not a solid fact) And as all engineers know, design is partly opinion.
What I am saying is that the devil is in the detail and my personal quest is to find cartridges that do all the things that are really needed without getting to the 'unnecessary' stage of performance or price.
I concede that if I were a trap shooter I would focus on cartridges in a more consistent way and the science could escalate for me. Sporting does allow opinion and myth to exist a bit more..
Chard
Well-known member
Ed would probably use Pro Ones in a shootoff. As he's already said, they're his favourites, and as I said, we all have a favourite.
But that doesn't mean they're better, it just means he's happy with them.
Will Hewland
Well-known member
Well, the huge potential task of aligning the perfect cartridge (and choke) to every possible -non forewarned- target presentation is so large that to a degree we hedge monkeys need to 'forget it' or face brain overload.So , are you saying that sporting shooter's don't think ?
So what I am saying is that most Sporting shooters seek a great compromise set up and then just think 'target/ target strategy' and little else when at the shoot.
Last edited by a moderator:
EdSolomons
Well-known member
Would, and did! Seemed to work ok for me
and they targets were not what you would have called close... Could have swapped to somethi g like a Sov FITASC if I thought it would help, but if Pro Ones got me there in the first place, why change to something "better" (more expensive). I know a Pro one 7 will break a target at 100 yards no problem, what more do I need to know about a shell? someone hand counted the pellets? bigger brass on it? Nice box?Ill focus on the bit that matters- sending it in the right direction!
Will Hewland
Well-known member
You get ones with big brass? I'm dumping what I've got and switching then.Would, and did! Seemed to work ok for me
Ill focus on the bit that matters- sending it in the right direction!
Everyone knows bigger brass makes a huge difference, also gold coloured is better than silver... :logik:Would, and did! Seemed to work ok for me
Ill focus on the bit that matters- sending it in the right direction!
I am using Gamebore Velocity 7.5 which is the best cheap cartridge around for me and white gold 8's as I just really like them and I am an impressionable fella .
I used to use Hull pro ones and Sovereigns, I could never tell the difference between them but the sovereigns had bigger brass :spiteful: again great carts but I struggle getting them nowadays near me.
If I had a choice of a free supply for a year of any cart it would be either pro one or white gold and at the moment the white gold would have the edge, seeing as I don't have a free supply the velocity make a compelling case.
P
** Pending Removal **
Guest
Quite....as i said.
Ed does not use the cheapest Hull cartridge, he uses one of their competition cartridges. They do have cheaper one you know :laugh:
Everyone picks the ones they are happy with.
FOB make a cheap as chips trainer cartridge that performs (IMHO) better than some of their top range ones.......true story..!
P1Fanatic
Well-known member
Doesn't Digweed use White Gold as standard and for the longer record shots I thought he used Black Gold? Niether are what I would call budget cartridges.Eley Olympics £160 per thousand I've been using for 3 years and they haven't let me down!
I've let them down a few times! .!!
My brother (28 bore shot) will say the same a 21 or 24 gram load will break a clay at 70 meters from the target! my daughters 410 will all so fit the bill for this, any one in disbelieve please contact me and your more than welcome to come and try and see for your self a 21 gram cheap shell will kill just as good if not a little better as faster than your very expensive shells! Remember from the clay not the trap 90 meters 24 gram hull!!!!!
George digweed 150 yards with normal cartridge!
Depends on how much you wish to spend! but I promise any of the cheapest are just as good as the big names! It's just a Market to get in your mind that most expensive is better!
Will Hewland
Well-known member
When somebody says "choose your free cartridges" you won't, on principle take the cheap ones. Nobody says the expensive ones are worse, but it's likely that they don't achieve much extra for the price..
P
** Pending Removal **
Guest
P
** Pending Removal **
Guest
Chooooooooooose theeeeeeeeeeese.......
Will Hewland
Well-known member
P
** Pending Removal **
Guest
Personally I find it almost laughable to say this or that shell doesn't make a difference. Everything makes a difference, 21g against 24g makes a difference, you might kid yourself that it doesn't or quite simply not be on the required level to detect that difference (not being rude) but there is no way that an extra 50 pellets don't matter. Same with 24 against 28 and most certainly from shell to shell.
The difference is not in a single shot though, no good breaking a few 85 yaaaaard crossers with something and declaring it fit for a king, regardless of shot size, load or speed - it's the overall package that makes a difference. You have to be happy with the whole package, the cost, speed, shot size and hardness, availability, pattern density, recoil, packaging even. Now I'm the first to admit that brass height is just a marketing ploy but the fact remains that manufacturers of top end clay loads will put their best blend into the dearer ones hence why most of us tend to prefer these had price not been a factor.
Cheap shells are perfectly capable of helping you clean up some very tough stands but what they can't do is maintain your confidence levels right at the top, all the time. The slightest thing can let doubts enter your mind with obvious results, this is where the extra £30 matters, better breaks, hence easier to read hence easier to repeat.
The difference is not in a single shot though, no good breaking a few 85 yaaaaard crossers with something and declaring it fit for a king, regardless of shot size, load or speed - it's the overall package that makes a difference. You have to be happy with the whole package, the cost, speed, shot size and hardness, availability, pattern density, recoil, packaging even. Now I'm the first to admit that brass height is just a marketing ploy but the fact remains that manufacturers of top end clay loads will put their best blend into the dearer ones hence why most of us tend to prefer these had price not been a factor.
Cheap shells are perfectly capable of helping you clean up some very tough stands but what they can't do is maintain your confidence levels right at the top, all the time. The slightest thing can let doubts enter your mind with obvious results, this is where the extra £30 matters, better breaks, hence easier to read hence easier to repeat.
Will Hewland
Well-known member
Yes. The simple equation is 'I like them, I can afford them, I am confident they will do what I want. I can now get on and think 99% about that ashtray in the sky`
Last edited by a moderator:
I found myself at West Kent Shooting School today and spent some time watching the ZZ selection shoot, there is no way I'd be shooting that with cheap 7.5's. I would want a 1550 plastic load of 6%+ antimony 6.5's loaded into a pure brass shell with just the merest hint of plastic at the end, just enough to crimp up. 8)
I would want a 1550 plastic load of 6%+ antimony 6.5's loaded into a pure brass shell with just the merest hint of plastic at the end, just enough to crimp up. 8) Similar threads
