Bogey birdtha
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BTC3
Well-known member
If you have one of those autos with a break barrel (Beretta, I think), does the fact the cartridges eject out the bottom have an impact on choke selection or shot string?
Mutley
Well-known member
To test your shot string, you need a moving pattern plate, read Shotgunning, the art and the science, by Bob Brister. He helped develop Winchester shells and the B&P MB Superstar live pigeon load, they towed a trailer behind a truck at about 55mph, 35yds from the shooter and fired at the front to check the pattern on the plate which was about 20ft long. Then they fastened dead ducks to the plate to check which part of the string penetrated the best....
It is said that back in the day whaler's did something similar with the blue whale to get some idea of how far in front the had to fire the harpoon. Four men in a rowing boat towed a dead blue behind it to let the harpooner have an idea of the amount of lead he was required to give of course that was in the days of hand held harpoons ... that all changed when Fiocchi brought in the FFblack as the whales called it... it was a game changer in whaling
Wonko the Sane
Well-known member
The gas bled off in an auto to make the action function has an immense effect on not only choke selection for proper shot string but POI and as a consequence the necessity to adjust POA and prolly LOP as well.
In the real world - the conceptualization provided by Brister's experiment, as best as I can tell from comments, is false. The time frame for the shot string traversing the target path is not adequate to make any difference in 24/28/32 whatever gm loads. The shot may be strung out but it is not a lovely swath across the sky (obviously Hogwarts physics in action) as it all ends up in the same place the gun was pointed when the thing went off AND the target only moves fractions of an inch in the time all the shot arrives at the target path whether it is on the target or not.
Its always more rewarding to see some comments about the "firehose technique" in shot string discussions since they really do go hand in hand.
In the real world - the conceptualization provided by Brister's experiment, as best as I can tell from comments, is false. The time frame for the shot string traversing the target path is not adequate to make any difference in 24/28/32 whatever gm loads. The shot may be strung out but it is not a lovely swath across the sky (obviously Hogwarts physics in action) as it all ends up in the same place the gun was pointed when the thing went off AND the target only moves fractions of an inch in the time all the shot arrives at the target path whether it is on the target or not.
Its always more rewarding to see some comments about the "firehose technique" in shot string discussions since they really do go hand in hand.
Paul120
Well-known member
I thought that it was an all direction expansion from a single point, like a ball being inflated.
Thats the theory anyway.. Can't think of the name of it though.
Thats the theory anyway.. Can't think of the name of it though.
BTC3
Well-known member
FBlu surely...It is said that back in the day whaler's did something similar with the blue whale to get some idea of how far in front the had to fire the harpoon. Four men in a rowing boat towed a dead blue behind it to let the harpooner have an idea of the amount of lead he was required to give of course that was in the days of hand held harpoons ... that all changed when Fiocchi brought in the FFblack as the whales called it... it was a game changer in whaling
Wonko the Sane
Well-known member
No - the process is way more complicated than that and a combination of choke effect and simple aerodynamic drag.
Mutley
Well-known member
I have a friend who was in the RN a number of years ago, when we devolped the anti-aircraft guided by radar ship protection system, the fleet was across the pond about to demo to our bretheren from the USofA. The Americans were going to attack our ship with a remote controlled jet, and our radar guided anti aircraft guns were going to shoot it down.It is said that back in the day whaler's did something similar with the blue whale to get some idea of how far in front the had to fire the harpoon. Four men in a rowing boat towed a dead blue behind it to let the harpooner have an idea of the amount of lead he was required to give of course that was in the days of hand held harpoons ... that all changed when Fiocchi brought in the FFblack as the whales called it... it was a game changer in whaling
At the critical moment of time to demo, the software demons awoke, and a shout went out that it wasnt working, to save face the Captain and Admiral decided to give a demo of how it used to be done... So one of the old ex WW2 gunners was told to bluff his way through a demo, he proceeded to tell the watching hordes, he would need a fly past first while he fired a wooden dummy shell from the 8" to get an idea of lead required as he had never tried it with a jet.. He proudly put the dummy through the centre of said plane....
The friendly Americans were not impressed.... He was called up in front of the Admiral that evening and presented with a case of rum......
So I think he was on 1/4 choke for a target crossing at 300+mph at 1/2 a mile.....
"Its always more rewarding to see some comments about the "firehose technique" in shot string discussions since they really do go hand in hand. "
True story ... second today. My old man was in the RN before during and after the second world war. It is weird but he described how when the were under attack from "hostiles" the never used to use the sight ring on a auto gun the would " hose pipe" onto the target using tracer fire. I don't know if this is even possible I am however glad I was not one of the poor *******s that were called up to do it. Me old man was not called up he was already there
True story ... second today. My old man was in the RN before during and after the second world war. It is weird but he described how when the were under attack from "hostiles" the never used to use the sight ring on a auto gun the would " hose pipe" onto the target using tracer fire. I don't know if this is even possible I am however glad I was not one of the poor *******s that were called up to do it. Me old man was not called up he was already there
chippy
Well-known member
Wonko the Sane
Well-known member
Perfectly possible but a completely different thing done with multiple shotsTrue story ... second today. My old man was in the RN before during and after the second world war. It is weird but he described how when the were under attack from "hostiles" the never used to use the sight ring on a auto gun the would " hose pipe" onto the target using tracer fire. I don't know if this is even possible I am however glad I was not one of the poor *******s that were called up to do it. Me old man was not called up he was already there
Doctor Lecter
Well-known member
surely dtl targets don't change ? weather affected yes , sporting shooters are told 1/4 and 1/2 choke is ample , so it must be ok for dtl surely .
PhilR
Well-known member
Can shot string tie you up in knots??
Mutley
Well-known member
Nahh, thats silly string.......
