Cartridges , value for money versus cost

[FESkent]

re fiocchi shot sizes, they make a range of English Traditional cartridges these they say are true uk shot sizes so 7.1/2 should be 2.3mm their other cartridges use Italian shot sizes so 7.1/2 will be 2.4mm or u.k. 7.

Demand for their cartridges has been out stripping what they can make given the global shortage of materials since russia invade ukraine. They manufacture for all markets in Italy and hence UK share is only a part of what they are able to make and hence continuity of supply has been a problem for a while. 
In the long term they will manufacture here in the U.K. as they own lyalvale express however I guess the russian invasion has not helped with that objective.

Traditional English range

https://fiocchi.com/en/catalog/ammo/shotshells/12-gauge.html?line_name=328

 

[Jonny English]

At our local shop a couple of weeks ago velocity plus were £247 a thou and f blus £233

This week velocity plus are £269 and f blus are £270 so fiocchi have made up a little ground with the current price rises.

 

[jasper]

 

[FESkent]

fblus are 5% hard shot, not sure about velocity plus. 

Guess once the price rises settle it will be a case of exactly which are best value.

 

[Robden]

Don't know if it's true, but been told by "someone in the know," that Eley Hawk cartridges didn't HAVE to put up the price of their cart's. If they didn't, then demand would have easily outstripped supply, due to material shortages. 

 

[philpot]

Not sure if it is true but I was told that China is now the largest user of lead buying vast amounts for their own use which if true would go toward the issues of material shortages.

 

[Charliedog]

Was told its the gunpowder mainly due to use in Ukraine conflict, no idea if its true

 

[Martinj]

.  .  .  .

I shot about 6 FBlus and the recoil is fine. Not smooth, with a quick “crack” type feel, but not too high. Certainly a cartridge that I don’t think you could go very wrong with especially if they remain decent value. 

I bought 1000 FBLU's (old stock) at £235 at the weekend and was told that the next batch will probably sell at £270/1000. 

 

[Luke_(NL)]

My club's just increased the club cartridges (either Velocity+ or English Sporting) to £8 a box, up from £7.50. And I noticed the 20 bores are now £9.50 a box! I might have to start just hurling insults at the clays and see if that breaks them instead.

Or at least their spirit

 

[jonz]

With the latest jump in cartridge prices, has anyone thought of forming a syndicate say 15 or 20 shooters and buying a 100 thousand direct from the cartridge manufacturers? Would this cut one step in the supply chain and reduce prices?

 

[Will Hewland]

With the latest jump in cartridge prices, has anyone thought of forming a syndicate say 15 or 20 shooters and buying a 100 thousand direct from the cartridge manufacturers? Would this cut one step in the supply chain and reduce prices?

Great idea but you struggle to get a mix of shooters to agree on which cartridge. And they all need to be those that can afford 5-10000 in one hit. You would probably need to get them branded differently to buy direct, but last time I checked they would do that for just one artwork cost for 10000, so probably nothing on 100,000

 

[Charliedog]

I managed to get some trade prices on a high end cartridge recently (pre this imminent rise), there is a saving of £22 per thousand if you order 28,000 plus.

 

[philpot]

I may be very well mistaken here but isn't there a matter of law that states you cannot have more than 5000 cartridges held at home.  I would also have thought that the manufacturer is already selling those cartridges to the dealers / grounds so why would they sell them to a syndicate at less profit. I would not want to be the guy who has to unload that amount of weight by hand unless of course you happen to have a fork truck.  A nice idea though.

 

[Will Hewland]

I may be very well mistaken here but isn't there a matter of law that states you cannot have more than 5000 cartridges held at home.  I would also have thought that the manufacturer is already selling those cartridges to the dealers / grounds so why would they sell them to a syndicate at less profit. I would not want to be the guy who has to unload that amount of weight by hand unless of course you happen to have a fork truck.  A nice idea though.

I believe it’s 10,000 and it’s a pretty unenforced law. I had about 12,000 in when I had Firearms officer visit. He just said “ready for a war then”. 

 

[MartynB]

Having been the secretary of a shooting syndicate , I know It’s easier to herd cats than get 15 shooters to pay  £1500 each into an account , on time , in full  . I’m not saying it’s not possible , but you’re talking about managing 20 or 30 grand , and having it available to pay your supplier who isn’t going to give credit  terms to you .  
 

The storage bit is about the volume of powder calculated from the shells . It’s one of those problems that isn’t a problem until it is , if you know what I mean . 
 

 

[Will Hewland]

I tried a few of the new Gamebore Rose Golds plas wad today. I’m a fan / user of Gamebore EVO but always have an eye out for a smooth shell. (Evos are pretty smooth). Rose Gold are marketed as smooth recoil hence wanting to try them.

Not a scientific test. I just shot about 12 of them at EJC reg today. They have a “quicker” recoil feel, a shorter sharper punch but perfectly acceptable. However NOT smoother than an EVO to my senses. They cost more than Evos so definitely not about to change to them. It’s also a relief I don’t have to say I shoot a cartridge called Rose Gold    

Kills were fine. These were an “8” shot but that means 2.3mm with these, so a UK 7.5 to my mind. (EVO 8 is 2.2mm; go figure..)

In fact, IIRC they felt rather like an FBlu but for lots more money..

 

[mpmilo]

I got given a box of Rose Golds to have a go with along with a couple of other people, I also gave some to 2 of my mates. These were FIBRE wads and we all found them punchy and a lot louder than anything we normally shoot. F blacks, Pro One  and F3.

Kills were good and they seem to keep a good centre dense pattern, I have not tried the plastic wads but would expect recoil to be a little better. They seem to be on the expensive side but will have lots of positive marketing i expect. Not for me.

 

[Robden]

I got given a box of Rose Golds to have a go with along with a couple of other people, I also gave some to 2 of my mates. These were FIBRE wads and we all found them punchy and a lot louder than anything we normally shoot. F blacks, Pro One  and F3.

Kills were good and they seem to keep a good centre dense pattern, I have not tried the plastic wads but would expect recoil to be a little better. They seem to be on the expensive side but will have lots of positive marketing i expect. Not for me.

Tried the 24g plastic and found them quite soft but good kills. Also tried the 28g which were more punchy, but the three of us all had trouble with mis-fires so returned them.

 

[bostonmick]

I don't think there is anything at the moment that is value for money.profiteering is the watchword for all things

 

[Garwood]

It`s just a case of picking up whatever you can that`s least silly atm.I`ve just bought 2k of Lyalvale Power Blue/Red after using a few when I ran out at a shooting ground.Would never have looked at them before but they seem a pleasant enough cartridge and certainly do the business and my usual Hull 100`s are more £££ now.