CPSA Awards

[jonz]

So what is everyone’s view on the CPSA Awards of the Year? Some of them are in my opinion very well deserved, Clay Shooter of the year couldn’t have gone to a better person also Lady Shooter of the year, but the others seem a little odd to me. Ground of the year didn’t hold a major CPSA event, Course setter of the year didn’t set the course of a major event, and as far as I know the coach of the year hasn’t coached the winner of a major championship. So why didn’t the coaches of the Olympic medal winners get coach of the year and why didn’t the grounds that put on the best championship layouts get ground of the year? It just seems that those with the biggest social media coverage get the awards and not the most deserved… I am probably going to get proved wrong but these are just my thoughts
Jonz

 

[Charliedog]

Did you nominate any? Did you vote? General apathy with shooters. I do not disagree with what you say though.

 

[jonz]

Did you nominate any? Did you vote? General apathy with shooters. I do not disagree with what you say though.

No I didn’t nominate or vote, I got so disillusioned with the CPSA some years ago that I never renewed my membership.

 

[Orl000]

Would have gladly voted for oddjobs lot good going oddjob,but not in cpsa yet.

 

[SBL]

I felt a little sorry for Johnny being given the title of influencer of the year. I don’t think the term “influencer” gives a great image these days. I also think he does a great job of taking reviews, information, tuition and experiences to the public. I’d say he’s significantly more than an influencer.

 

[instructor_max]

I’d love to hear your opinion on how you’d choose referee of the year

I may not have coached major winners, but if I wasn’t doing an exceptional job across the board then I wouldn’t have got enough votes to win.

Social media has a play, but if I was doing a bad job then it wouldn’t make a difference.

 

[Dsh]

So what is everyone’s view on the CPSA Awards of the Year? Some of them are in my opinion very well deserved, Clay Shooter of the year couldn’t have gone to a better person also Lady Shooter of the year, but the others seem a little odd to me. Ground of the year didn’t hold a major CPSA event, Course setter of the year didn’t set the course of a major event, and as far as I know the coach of the year hasn’t coached the winner of a major championship. So why didn’t the coaches of the Olympic medal winners get coach of the year and why didn’t the grounds that put on the best championship layouts get ground of the year? It just seems that those with the biggest social media coverage get the awards and not the most deserved… I am probably going to get proved wrong but these are just my thoughts
Jonz

I’m a Cpsa member and instructor here in sunny Scotland . I tend not to vote as it’s usually all based around England (not that it bothers me as I knew this when I joined and done my instructor course 6/7 years ago) but having said that I certainly don’t mind someone getting nominated for what they do even if I don’t actually know all they do because it obviously takes more than a handful of votes to win anything. As far as mr instructor max winning coach of the year? It doesn’t bother me that he has won and well done him. I don’t think you have to be coaching world champions or regularly making world champions to be deserving or winning it? Surely introducing people to the sport or improving club level shooters to achieve better scores is worth being recognised? As far as I can see by his ground availability it is mostly his job so good on him!! If there were more grounds handy this side of the border I would certainly try make a living from it rather than a part time thing. One thing I will say though whether it’s cpsa or apsi or basc is clay coaching in general is a very cleeky world! People that are fellow coaches can sometimes not like the fact you are coaching incase you take customers from them? That’s something I notice here in Scotland! These grounds don’t like outside coaches coming in to make money so I tend to do all my stuff on peg in winter.

 

[k80ben]

Nathan truly deserves his title the rest are pointless and hold no weight at all. A few Facebook pictures but that’s about it

 

[jonz]

I’d love to hear your opinion on how you’d choose referee of the year

I may not have coached major winners, but if I wasn’t doing an exceptional job across the board then I wouldn’t have got enough votes to win.

Social media has a play, but if I was doing a bad job then it wouldn’t make a difference.

Referee of the year, probably one that knows the rules and implements them, i.e stops the cheating ( I hit that clay,that was a no bird etc) stops the coaching in the cage, calls the lost birds etc.. that would be a start
As for your award I never said you were doing a bad job , just that there are others that have coached winners
An award of the year should be for the best of the best not for the most followed on Facebook and instagram etc
But of course these are just my thoughts.

 

[Freddypip]

Just looked at the results and understand Max won the coach of the year. Well done and from what I have seen well deserved. It was refreshing to see that category filled with ‘younger’ coaches who have enough time and energy to not feel obliged to tick the CPSA box of conformity which can (sometimes) result in a nomination from time served as opposed to how good they are.

My own feeling of the CPSA is that they are too self-focused. It's the same problem that inflicts many such organizations. Too busy thanking and awarding themselves and those who work for the organization than realizing much of what they represent is going on elsewhere. I work in insurance and the same problem exists - awards are not given out because of who deserves it that year but who's turn it is or who the representative body want to side with.

I have a lot of time for TGS and Johnny Carter. It is however a business. It might be ‘influencing’ those around but I prefer to categorize it as promotion of the sport through social media; less about the person as such and more about their impact clay shooting in general.

 

[instructor_max]

Referee of the year, probably one that knows the rules and implements them, i.e stops the cheating ( I hit that clay,that was a no bird etc) stops the coaching in the cage, calls the lost birds etc.. that would be a start
As for your award I never said you were doing a bad job , just that there are others that have coached winners
An award of the year should be for the best of the best not for the most followed on Facebook and instagram etc
But of course these are just my thoughts.

Yeah, but I want the best ref, I want the ref of winners.

I can’t guarantee that the Coaches of these “winners” are CPSA qualified Coaches, which is part of the issue.

 

[jonz]

Yeah, but I want the best ref, I want the ref of winners.

I can’t guarantee that the Coaches of these “winners” are CPSA qualified Coaches, which is part of the issue.

OK let’s assume you are into shooting competitions, you have ambitions to improve yourself and try to make it to national level, you want to get a coach to help you, who would you rather have someone who has been at the top and has proven record of coaching winners, or someone who’s got a good social media presence and is a jolly good bloke but hasn’t got any of his clients to the top….. I know what most would do regardless of if they hold a piece of paper issued by the CPSA

 

[instructor_max]

OK let’s assume you are into shooting competitions, you have ambitions to improve yourself and try to make it to national level, you want to get a coach to help you, who would you rather have someone who has been at the top and has proven record of coaching winners, or someone who’s got a good social media presence and is a jolly good bloke but hasn’t got any of his clients to the top….. I know what most would do regardless of if they hold a piece of paper issued by the CPSA.

Yeah, but at the end of the day, the CPSA awards are about celebrating members of the CPSA—those who have taken the time to go through their system. It’s no different from the referees; I’d assume you can’t win the award without being a CPSA-qualified ref. That doesn’t necessarily mean they’re the best ref, best volunteer etc—it just means they’ve met the criteria within that framework, it’s as simple as that.

That’s completely fine—those individuals are free to choose whom they want to see. After all, we’re in a free country, and no one is dictating their preferences.

 

[Freddypip]

There in lies the problem with the CPSA & coaching. The mantra is - do our coaching course(s) and coach the way we coach and by then you are part of the fold. The courses are perfectly suitable for basic & some advances coaching but the CPSA qualifications have their limitations - not necessary in terms of what they teach but their prescriptive nature & method of assessment. I realised very quickly when doing my level 1 that the CPSA route would not work for me as my brain prefers bits of factual information & not rules & orders.

I might be wrong here, but many of the top coaches are not CPSA qualified and going back to do them would be regressive - making them reset methods & systems that a decent (and certainly world class coach) already has working well (and I would suggest much better) for them. The precise order of some safety guidance is not relevant and folllowing a prescritive CPSA Level One 'gun fit' achieves nothing when the coach & client are well past that point - it's counterproductive.

My late wife was a primary school head. The term differentiation was used - "tailoring lessons to each student's needs". In my view the CPSA system doesn't really address this both in terms of accepting those attending the courses (when they are the student) will have different learning & teaching styles and then passing that onto how end Clients are taught. The more prescriptive the course ism the less flexibility for the student to personalise it with their own experience, learning & understanding. the problem is allowing for differentiation is that those teaching need understand different learning styles, skillsets, etc when the easier option is to not bother and simple ask if they are following the process strictly.

Edited to add this - My comment about those notminated for coach of the year this year is that they appear young enough to pass the CPSA courses and then devise their own personalities - recognising that the CPSA courses are just a start.

 

[instructor_max]

There in lies the problem with the CPSA & coaching. The mantra is - do our coaching course(s) and coach the way we coach and by then you are part of the fold. The courses are perfectly suitable for basic & some advances coaching but the CPSA qualifications have their limitations - not necessary in terms of what they teach but their prescriptive nature & method of assessment. I realised very quickly when doing my level 1 that the CPSA route would not work for me as my brain prefers bits of factual information & not rules & orders.

I might be wrong here, but many of the top coaches are not CPSA qualified and going back to do them would be regressive - making them reset methods & systems that a decent (and certainly world class coach) already has working well (and I would suggest much better) for them. The precise order of some safety guidance is not relevant and folllowing a prescritive CPSA Level One 'gun fit' achieves nothing when the coach & client are well past that point - it's counterproductive.

My late wife was a primary school head. The term differentiation was used - "tailoring lessons to each student's needs". In my view the CPSA system doesn't really address this both in terms of accepting those attending the courses (when they are the student) will have different learning & teaching styles and then passing that onto how end Clients are taught. The more prescriptive the course ism the less flexibility for the student to personalise it with their own experience, learning & understanding. the problem is allowing for differentiation is that those teaching need understand different learning styles, skillsets, etc when the easier option is to not bother and simple ask if they are following the process strictly.

Edited to add this - My comment about those notminated for coach of the year this year is that they appear young enough to pass the CPSA courses and then devise their own personalities - recognising that the CPSA courses are just a start.

A great point.

I completed my APSI level 10 years ago at 21, and then my CPSA at 24. I’ll be 32 this May. I’ve been in this field for six years now, and it’s been a journey full of ups and downs. My shooting skills have grown significantly over time, marked by a steep learning curve. Last year was the best yet for both me and my clients—I steered my own course, focusing less on accumulating qualifications and more on investing in my own development and shooting practice, which has ultimately benefited those I coach.

Everyone’s journey is different

 

[jonz]

Yeah, but at the end of the day, the CPSA awards are about celebrating members of the CPSA—those who have taken the time to go through their system. It’s no different from the referees; I’d assume you can’t win the award without being a CPSA-qualified ref. That doesn’t necessarily mean they’re the best ref, best volunteer etc—it just means they’ve met the criteria within that framework, it’s as simple as that.

That’s completely fine—those individuals are free to choose whom they want to see. After all, we’re in a free country, and no one is dictating their preferences.

The CPSA should be focused on growing the sport improving the image of clay shooting and having the best of the best to bring its members in to the level they want to achieve, not settling for second best just because the best are outside of their criteria, this is why I stopped paying my subscription fee some years ago. They seem to have an agenda of their own and it’s not necessarily doing the best for the sport or the members
You can take all the courses and qualifications on the planet it won’t necessarily make you the best in your field, it just means you’re good at getting qualified, getting people to achieve their potential is what makes a good coach and in this sport they are few and far between

 

[k80ben]

Good instructors who are built on reputation and success and don’t need very poor accreditation

The rest don’t and need the certificate but eventually those student go to the reputations to be fixed

And the accredited instructors try and charge way more than they are worth

 

[jonz]

Good instructors who are built on reputation and success and don’t need very poor accreditation

The rest don’t and need the certificate but eventually those student go to the reputations to be fixed

And the accredited instructors try and charge way more than they are worth

Totally agree with you, far too many expensive button pushers who can’t do more than get someone to be safe with a gun

 

[instructor_max]

This has been truly enlightening.