Closing the gun

[Bebo]

No downside in having a safety on a clay gun...

You've made it into the shoot-offs at the English Open Sporting.  It's your first time in the final of a really big competition and the nerves are on edge.  You've shot really well through it so far and you're about to shoot your final targets.  It's a big sim pair.  George has shot his last pair, he's one clay ahead of you with only you to shoot.  You just have to make sure that you get this pair and that's it, you're English Open Champion!  You load your cartridges, thinking of the best way to take the first target, close the gun with a deep breath and call pull.  You've got your hold point perfect, pull away to the lead you need, knowing for certain this one is going to break, you squeeze the trigger and CLICK!  Oh dear, all that stress and pressure and you missed that step in your pre-shot routine where you release the safety.  Pair lost and your first ever big win disappears down the plughole.

 

[Sian]

The most worrying thing about the safety is the reliance people put on it.  It really isn’t that reliable. Agree with Bebo on the clay ground it really doesn’t have a place.  Our whole set up is you don’t load until you are in position and ready to shoot.

 

[ColinD]

Agreed, rather the gun broken than a safety any day

 

[jwpzx9r]

Agreed, rather the gun broken than a safety any day

I agree but would ask this question. Is the safety on a shotgun there so that a shooter can knowingly carry around a loaded gun ? Surely that cannot be right? Or wait is it so that when the shooter opens his gun and then drops in the cartridges closes the gun and readies for the shot the safety is there to remind him to take the safety off? Safety catches on any weapon do not make, to me at any rate, sense because who would knowingly carry a gun with one up the spout as it were. Even in the middle of a line of trap if there is a problem that requires a halt to shooting the automatic thing that is required from all shooters is that any cartridges must be removed from their gun they are asked to do this by the referee. 

 

[ColinD]

Shoot target rifle and they have a  safety catch, when not shooting bolt up and breech flag inserted or bolt removed, never rely on a safety.

Best ask the manufactoriers why they fit them

 

[Wonko the Sane]

Later on he had to sell up... not an easy thing to do when there is a mega recession in play. 

we all have our crosses to bear

 

[Guest]

I find a bigger bug bear(bare?) is people who use autos where probably they are used to over/unders , they go through all the correct procedures to put flag in the turn around with gun and point it at waist height as they leavethe cage /confer with their buddies , unwittingingly obviously , seen it many many times , flag or not it makes me cringe. 

 

[Paul120]

 I find the Automatic safety great when double/triple gunning. It makes sure there's no accidental discharge when the loader/loaders hand me the gun and saves me the effort in switching it off. I did hear for those that have to venture off the peg  it  gives a degree of protection against accidental trigger pulls when waist deep in brambles, dense wood etc where  a branch could catch the trigger.

 

[westley]

Well the police have taken off accident with the abreviation RTA to Road traffic incident (other forces may word it differently) so it looks like in their books there's no accident anymore where their concerned

Although the term 'RTA' was used as a matter of course, I was informed in 1974 when I joined, that there was no such thing as a Traffic Accident and in almost 30 years of dealing with many, I found that to be true  !

I find a bigger bug bear(bare?) is people who use autos where probably they are used to over/unders , they go through all the correct procedures to put flag in the turn around with gun and point it at waist height as they leavethe cage /confer with their buddies , unwittingingly obviously , seen it many many times , flag or not it makes me cringe. 

Yes I have noticed a lot of other Shooters 'Taking the Knee' when I turn around in the cage to show them all that I have my red flag correctly installed  !   I just thought it was an 'IN' thing   !

 

[westley]

I use 3 different types of gun for my shooting, a semi auto, which I am having to use at present due to a shoulder problem.  When I use it for clays the safety stays off from when it comes out of the cabinet. My usual clay gun an O/U has a manual safe which is permanently off (apart from when cleaning it). My O/U game gun, a 20 bore 'Field' model with an auto safe, which stays on until  actually mounting the gun in order to shoot. I probably use the 20 bore around 10 times a year for clay shooting and to date, have not been caught out with the safety catch. I have another old semi auto which is used for pigeon shooting and the safety is on, again until the act of mounting the gun prior to firing it. As soon as I have shot the gun, it is reloaded and the safety re-applied. I am fully aware of what a safety catch does and how it works and that is the reason to reapply it, when behind a cammo net. However I do NOT see the need to even have a safety catch on a dedicated clay gun (and some didn't have one fitted). The problem being of course,  that some sporting and even trap guns,  are now being used on game shoots where I find them a useful addition in helping to prevent a discharge due to a snagged trigger. The only problem is I constantly see game shooters push off the safety catch as soon as the gun is closed.

 

[westley]

I go with that... and a bit further. Where I shoot you are told when you can load your gun and told when the series is finished and guns should be unloaded. The only gun I see as being in anyway contentious when it comes to whether a gun is loaded or un loaded on a trap ground is a semi ... which, controversially, I think should be banned! ... not going to win any friends with that one  :lol:

AND on what biased opinion is that based upon then   ?      

 

[jwpzx9r]

AND on what biased opinion is that based upon then   ?      

Safety and the mess they leave behind. As soon as I see a semi auto come onto the ground I want to leave! Detestable things so they are I had a guy hitting me with his empties from post three when I was on five 

 

[westley]

Safety and the mess they leave behind. As soon as I see a semi auto come onto the ground I want to leave! Detestable things so they are I had a guy hitting me with his empties from post three when I was on five 

I think my record was stand 4 from stand 1. I used to pick up my empties between targets but you know how touchy those 'Trappies' are. So, I just left them there for the others to trip over, until the end of the line. Can I presume then, that you and I are never going to shoot together,  ever   ?   Well, I have to say that I am totally gutted   !   

 

[jwpzx9r]

I think my record was stand 4 from stand 1. I used to pick up my empties between targets but you know how touchy those 'Trappies' are. So, I just left them there for the others to trip over, until the end of the line. Can I presume then, that you and I are never going to shoot together,  ever   ?   Well, I have to say that I am totally gutted   !   

To be fair the gun is not the problem at all it is the people who shoot them... and in my experience down here at any rate these tend to be young lads that have little experience of shooting who have been loaned a gun for the day to play. Unlike in the UK down here you can get a day shooters license for 6€ ... so literally anybody can turn up and shoot ... still don't like them though :lol:  Young lad had an interesting gun a few weeks back some sort of Beretta that you broke the gun to put the two shells in... it was not so bad it shot the empties out the front and you could see the gun was empty and broken.

 

[westley]

To be fair the gun is not the problem at all it is the people who shoot them... and in my experience down here at any rate these tend to be young lads that have little experience of shooting who have been loaned a gun for the day to play. Unlike in the UK down here you can get a day shooters license for 6€ ... so literally anybody can turn up and shoot ... still don't like them though :lol:  Young lad had an interesting gun a few weeks back some sort of Beretta that you broke the gun to put the two shells in... it was not so bad it shot the empties out the front and you could see the gun was empty and broken.

I used a Remmie 1100 Trap for years and shot more straights with that gun,  than any other since. There was a Gunsmith who was doing a modification of fitting a small piece of round metal rod into the back end of the breech metal of the barrel. This had the effect of deflecting the spent cartridges downwards and worked extremely well, so well that I wondered why Remmie never did it themselves. My local gunshop has a Remmie 1100 Trap on the shelf and lo and behold, it has the modification fitted. I am seriously tempted.......................if for no other reason,  than to pee off the other Trappies   !        

 

[Alan Surry]

My old physics teacher had a saying which always preceded in some unfortunate kid getting the cane.

“There is no such thing as an accident.  It’s either an act of God or negligence”. 

There was only one kid who pulled the “Act of God” line and he got caned so hard we all learnt not to f*** up in the first place.  

Wise words. 

 

[ColinD]

My old physics teacher had a saying which always preceded in some unfortunate kid getting the cane.

“There is no such thing as an accident.  It’s either an act of God or negligence”. 

There was only one kid who pulled the “Act of God” line and he got caned so hard we all learnt not to f*** up in the first place.  

Wise words. 

Not so much a teacher as a sadist by the sounds of it then

 

[Alan Surry]

Not so much a teacher as a sadist by the sounds of it then

Quite possibly.  But I did well in physics and I haven’t forgotten his wise words. 

 

[Finners]

I do struggle with the apparent assumption that a gunslip would stop the shot should a live round left in the gun "go off" ie getting all steamed up about whether or not the gun should be open(ed) as it's inserted/removed from a slip is missing the point. 

To me, the precise method as to how you put your gun in a slip is far less important than making sure it's not loaded before you do so.

Surely therefore, whilst slipping/unslipping (made up verb?) a gun, retaining control over the gun by ensuring the barrels are always pointed in a safe direction and of course making sure the gun is empty is all that is required?

Ohh, and in the spirit of inclusion and diversity, this is true regardless of clay or game shooting  

 

[westley]

Just a small point , no one ever shot anyone accidentally. They were all shot negligently. 
 

I nearly shot someone accidentally.................................I was aiming for the guy behind him   !