TobyM
Well-known member
Top One plastics for me and have been for a bit. I rate them - good value (as a shell can be in this day and age), not too punchy and good kills. I'll be sticking to them for some time. Eley Olympics are good too.
Favourite cartridges.
- Thread starter VicW
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I had my first go on a pattern plate yesterday as part of an event I'm writing up for the main site shortly. Was really interesting to learn how the two different chokes in my gun affected my cartridges. I was using Lyalvale Express English Sporters yesterday - I got warned away from them a while back, but purchased some as an 'emergency' recently - and so far have had some of my highest scores. Maybe they are the one - but I have had to clean my gun a little 'harder' each weekend. I need to go back and do some more work with a variety of cartridges to check what works best with my gun and cartridges, but this looks like it could be time well spent.
TobyM
Well-known member
Nothing wrong with those, Matt. I used them when I came back from my lay-off. Perfectly acceptable. I really can't think that there's a bad shell out there TBH, but I haven't tried them all. All I want is not too punchy and they don't leave a load of cr*p down the barrel. I couldn't care less what colour they are, who makes them or how big the cap is. And low price, of course! /wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-smile.gif
woody
Well-known member
CleverSC3 said:
That's interesting. I have had my best scores since we got this batch of them. Like I say, we buy on value alone. The old guys who come to our shoot moaned like billio when we put the cost of a box of shells up 50p, about 3 years ago. I can't imagine they'd be to impressed if we stocked blue diamonds and they went up another quid. The last 4 brands that have been the cheapest (the first 3 at Country Way, west Malling, and the 4th at Sussex Guns, Catsfield) are: 1 - claybusters.2 - Hull comp x3 - Kent Velocity4 - Fiocchi Top One's. The claybusters are awful and even if they come out cheapest I doubt we'll be buying them again. sometimes you pull the trigger and shower confetti out of your gun. Kent velocity seem to be a hell of a bang on the shoulder, and dirty. Hull Comp X seem to be quiet and less punchy, and I was getting good kills with them, and now top one's, which for the money seem fine. Not a big kick, not too dirty, and I'm breaking clays. Of course every week that goes by is another bit of experience and I could be slowly improving. So pattern Plate. How do I do it? big board painted white, draw a clay sized target in the middle of it, and shoot it? from what distance. Cheers
Will Hewland
Well-known member
Hi,Yes, just a big steel plate usually. Paint it white and put a black cross on it if you want to test your point of impact. (See if you are high / low etc..) I just shoot it without the cross and see what sort of diameter and evenness of pattern I get. I do it it at 15, 20 and 25 yards usually. The other alternative is to shoot a piece of thickish cardboard (break down a cardboard box ). Against an earth bank one assumes.. This captures the pattern very well I am told. I tried putting large sheets of paper on to a steel pattern plate, but they just got blown to shreds! You will be surprised at the difference between cartridges. The cheap ones at 25 yards are very uneven and dispersed indeed.. Cheers,CSC3
TobyM
Well-known member
Load for load any AA shooter with confetti shells costing tuppence ha'penny a 1,000 will beat me using the canine's testicles shells at £250 / 1,000 You pay your money and take your choice, but at the end of the day it's where you point the gun! /wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif
Will Hewland
Well-known member
It is always 100% important where you point the gun. At long edgey stuff though, you may well get a chance of a miss from a perfectly aimed cheap shell.At anything over 20 yards, a classier shell will offer the shooter much more visual feedback, as its even pattern will show if the clay was hit on the side or middle. With a cheap cartridge, all breaks over a certain distance look like chips. The other balance to strike for me, is cost and how clean it leaves the gun (but maybe that is just me). For the record, I don't use the mega money shells, but I do stay away from the lower end stuff. I think a top-tip is to use a cheaper / medium level shell through a good bit of choke. Anybody who has done an amount of pattern testing will know that a cheap shell versus a really classy one offers something like a full half point of choke in effect. For a rough anecdotal example, you would find that at up to about 25 yards, a Hull Sovereign through a quarter choke will throw a similar pattern to a cheap shell through 3/4 choke. (At long range the hull will still remain even while the cheaper one will get patchy). Cheers,CSC3
I've used the Fiocchi Top Ones on and off for a good many years, often for weeks at a time but always tend to go back to Eley Superbs. As medium price shells go they are very good and to be onset I don't get chippy breaks all the way to maybe 30 yards but much beyond that for some reason I loose confidence.Personally I think the problem is to do with the grade of lead inside them rather than the pattern; they absolutely pulverise/smoke stuff inside 25 yards and I don't detect any appreciable speed difference between them and Superbs, the snappy gentle recoil is good news too.Last week I had a mid week knock-about 100 birder and fired a couple at a pattern plate from 25 yards and the result was just as I'd expected. Nice even dense patterns in keeping with my chosen chokes, no different to almost anything else I've seen over the years. I believe the less spectacular breaks at range are a result of low antimony (soft) lead. I won a few English Sporting the other day and they are orrrible, high recoil, headache fodder. I'll either swap them or use them out pigeoning.
I have to say the the English Sporter and the Nobel sport knock my around big time despite shooting a gas auto with a dead mule type recoil reduction system and a Kick eeze and I not a small guy by any stretch of the imagination. I have just switched to Gamebore Blue Diamond from Hull Pro fibre as they seem the same but I can get them cheaper, once they run out I'll be dropping down to Gamebore White Gold as they also work very well when I put it in the right place 
Cheers, Jon.
Cheers, Jon.
EdSolomons
Well-known member
The birds we see for sporting nowadays your all best off shooting the cheapest plaswad you can get your hands on providing it doesn't kick too much. A huge amount of the price difference is marketing bollocks.
EdSolomons said:
Music to my ears./wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-cool.gif
hnachaj
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 30, 2011
- Messages
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Patterns need tobe taken at the distance that one encounters. So, minimum pattern distances should be 25 yards or in my case 40 measured yards. I draw a on edge clay on building plans as they are 36 x 40 inches. It is amazing how bad bargain shells pattern at 40 yards with LM choke which more than sufficient at that distance. One really has to choke to get any semblance of reliable hits with the bargain stuff or, a lot of luck! The slow good stuff patterns at least one to two chokes tighter at ALL distance compared to the cheaper stuff! Even compared to the best NA cartridges, I was amazed at my patterns at 35 M with the RC red comfort and the RC Red Supernik. It is no wonder why Olympic shooters using 24 gr can smoke trap targets out to 60 plus yards with them! For you bargain shell shooters, a set of Muller chokes will definetly improve your patterns! They don't do any visible difference on the slow good stuff but amazing on the cheapy stuff! Tested and prooven! Over the winter, I will post some patterns of your crappy shells that one thinks so highly of! There is also some very scientific studies with videos of the so called, you broke the nose off, you are in front or you broke the tail off, you are behind. Horse papoop! It is all BULL! You can't scientificaly proove that! It has been prooven otherwise! More on that in the futur! But then there is my motto: "It is better to be lucky, than good and unlucky"! Remember that rabbit that bounced up as you squeezed the trigger? The Lone Canadian,Henry/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif
Henry,Do not try and bring the Muller Mafia here to the UK !We do not need another expensive diversion.A few have bought them and tried them without shrieking Ureeka.They may be lighter, they may well clean up easier, but that is about it.If you've got a set of Teagues you don't need alternatives.Henry, you should know better than anyone one that a different shell will make a significant change to pattern.I love RC's but Clever will give them a run for their money and indeed out perform them in some instances.BUT Olympics from Eley will suit us all, for performance versus cost they are very hard to beat.For what you save in money per thousand Olympics V SuperNiks you can do three more 100 bird shoots.
Mullers improve your sex appeal to the opposite sex - fact.I'd pay to watch anyone smoke 60 yard trap targets with 24 g.The RC Red Superniks I used fetched some nice long birds but gave poorer breaks than 7.5's Eley Superbs, probably because they are English 7's.Henry, the only reason you think LM sufficient for 40 yards is because yours throw Full pattern /wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-laugh.gif.I've read about those vids by the way but they only cover going aways, so make sure you come armed with the right stuff./wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif
Will Hewland
Well-known member
I admire Henrys fact based study of things and agree with most of it. But; YOU CAN ABSOLUTELY SEE WHETHER YOU HAVE HIT THE FRONT, BACK, TOP, OR MIDDLE OF A CLAY. (OK, not if it is a distant edge on, and you have a bad or overly blown pattern, but mostly). I would say that at every shoot I do, I see this, then adjust the lead slightly to improve. It always results in a better kill (unless you over correct and get a miss..). At Weston on Sunday, there was a quick sim pair, with the second bird shot as a slightly quartering edge on away. I gave it a foot of lead to the right on the first three and could see that it was being hit most heavily on the right. I backed the lead off to a few inches on the last bird and got a very even and heavier break. Sorry to be uncompromising here, but when you have demonstrated something to yourself about 500 times, you kinda get a trust in it../wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif CSC3
If Henry's vids and data are the same ones debated a few months ago on shotgunworld there won't be much proof of anything except in relation to trap shots. This one could run and run.....
EdSolomons
Well-known member
Ill be happy to do a 100 when we have a meet up that I can make usin the crappiest ounce plaswads on the Market- I bet there won't be too many chips and I'm pretty confident that upto 35/40 yard I can blow the side off an incomer to show where I was shooting.It's like challenge anneka but with less close fitting cat suits.
