Looking for a consensus of opinion

[ChrisPackham]

Hi everyone, I would really appreciate your help with this, it's a bit of a story but I think the information helps.

The biggest challenge a newbie faces, especially when they progress, is that of advice and where to go, what to do next. In am not naive enough to suggest that 'the interested says it so it just be true' but I can't help but notice the inherent conflict of interest that coaches, gun smiths, gun shops have, not through desire but through the fact that they are a business.

it is important to stress that I am not worried about spending money on my hobby, but equally I don't want to waste it.

i have a beretta evo e that was my first gun since I started out in January, it was classed as suitable for me by a shop who I trust and latterly had a little cast off applied by a gunsmith who I also trust. I had a couple of lessons with a cpsa coach who I trust who helped with gun mount predominantly, much of the rest of my learning has been through 'doing'.

i have always found that my faults were a tendency to lift my head off the stock and sometimes a flicking out of eye dominance (right eye dominant) otherwise if I a avoid these I shoot well, now at a Stage where if my score isn't in 80% I feel that I have not lived up to my expectations, so I am looking to eleminate the above and progress.

This season I have shot a few driven days using this gun and have changed the bead from the small fibre optic to the brass (which I lost) and now the standard white in an order to fit in better with the other guns using game guns (as well as fitting black chokes).  

When shooting clays the last couple of weeks I have noticed my eye dominance flick and my tendency to lift my head from a the stock, causing me to be miles off.

After my last game day I will switch back to the red bead but I am not sure this is all I need to do..

My quandary is thus ...... I understand completely the need for a consistent gun mount and I think that this has slipped, BUT I also now feel that if I am not consistently mounting the gun then the fit is such that I cannot 'naturally' consistently mount the gun.

My options are to go back to my coach (at 85 per hour) and correct mount, but it is in her interest for me to continue to have lessons to correct mount.

Go to gunshop, who I trust, but are in business to sell more or newer guns and a change to a grade 5 mk38 or 692 ( both of which I like) will costs over 1,000 which is a big chunk of shooting days budget for next season.

Go to gunsmith or stocker and have them look at an adjustable comb raiser to see if this would help, as well as re checking fit and potentially fit a recoil system at the same time, of course it is in their interest to have this work done. (Can I assume that an adjustable comb raiser and recoil pad won't affect value if I still need to trade, I am not expecting to get that money back but don't want to hurt value)

So, what I would really like is some collective advice from the shoot clay world who have no conflict as to the best way forward.

Another thought is that maybe my over ear defenders are causing the gun mount issue and should switch to in ear, but then I want to protect my hearing as best as I can..

Please help.......

 

[squimp]

You will get lots of conflicting advice on here.

Pick a coach/gunfitter that you trust and go and have 2 lessons with them. Check the gunfit at the first lesson and then work on the mount at home.

 On the second lesson check the mount. 

 

[Skeet UK]

As you will be aware, it is virtually impossible to "coach" you in this way, online.

What we can do, is highlight some possible areas to.look at.

Have you lost any weight recently?  Reason being, head lifting and inconsistent eye dominance, are possible symptoms of a comb that is too low.

You lift your head to see certain targets, when they are hidden by the barrels and, more likely on crossers, your dominant eye is obscured by the gun, and switches to your left eye.

Do you pre-mount?

 

[ChrisPackham]

As you will be aware, it is virtually impossible to "coach" you in this way, online.

What we can do, is highlight some possible areas to.look at.

Have you lost any weight recently?  Reason being, head lifting and inconsistent eye dominance, are possible symptoms of a comb that is too low.

You lift your head to see certain targets, when they are hidden by the barrels and, more likely on crossers, your dominant eye is obscured by the gun, and switches to your left eye.

Do you pre-mount?

Hi

This is great thank you, I was wondering about comb height, the Evo is said to have a low comb

Recently lost a little weight (thanks for noticing ..)

i don't tend to pre mount as this has been most noticed game shooting and my clay shooting recently has been game focuses to practice

Funnily enough, the crossers are the ones I am shooting better than ever...

i look forward to as much advice as possible, there should be some commonality....

You will get lots of conflicting advice on here.

Pick a coach/gunfitter that you trust and go and have 2 lessons with them. Check the gunfit at the first lesson and then work on the mount at home.

 On the second lesson check the mount. 

Thanks, that's good advice,mi have booked a lesson for Monday PM

Just a add another factor, I am obviously wearing more layers than usual, would that have an impact in this way? Maybe i should try the shorter butt pad?

 

[Irishgunner]

I think a lot of shooter get caught up worrying to much about gun fit and the gear there using in general. My advice would be to concentrate on your shooting trust the advice you have received, doubting your your gear and the advice you paid to receive is going to play havoc with your scores. 

 

[ChrisPackham]

I think a lot of shooter get caught up worrying to much about gun fit and the gear there using in general. My advice would be to concentrate on your shooting trust the advice you have received, doubting your your gear and the advice you paid to receive is going to play havoc with your scores. 

Thank you, this seems good advice.  One of the most helpful (if abrupt) comments i was given by a friend who is a very good shot was 'stop ****ing around, see it and shoot it, repeat'

 

[chippy]

Lifting your head and eye dominance problems can be caused by having your stock to low.

 

[EdSolomons]

As above 

 

[ChrisPackham]

Thanks guys, it seems that gun is lower in the stock than most... Could well be the catalyst.

 

[Will Hewland]

Thanks guys, it seems that gun is lower in the stock than most... Could well be the catalyst.

I haven't seen you of course.. But I have just transformed my mates shooting by getting him to shorten his stock and add an Isis comb raiser.

 

[chippy]

Its easy to check . Mount your gun with both eyes closed do this several times moving to imaginary clays in all directions each time open your right eye and check if your eye is central to the rib and that you can always see the bead.and some rib leading down to it.

 

[ChrisPackham]

I haven't seen you of course.. But I have just transformed my mates shooting by getting him to shorten his stock and add an Isis comb raiser.

Thanks Will, I am also wondering about stock length due winter clothing, looking at the gun being too long in the stock exaggerates the drop..

 

[westley]

Lifting your head and eye dominance problems can be caused by having your stock to low.

It can also be caused by poor gun mounting, due to increased clothing when game shooting. If you have another lesson booked, then take your game shooting jacket and get the Instructor to check your gunfit WEARING THAT JACKET. All the gunmounting practice goes out of the window if you put on a heavy and bulky coat which effectively lengthens your stock by aroiund 1". I remember a guest gun on my shoot who shot very badly in the morning, far below what he was capable of. I asked him at lunch what the problem was, his face was showing a red welt on his cheek. He went on to explain that he was wearing his 'new' shooting coat. I asked if he had the 'old' coat with him, the answer was 'yes'. A change of coat and he hardly missed a bird all afternoon. The old coat had been through the washing machine so many times, the padded lining had well sunk. The new coat had a thick lining. If all else fails take your coat off to shoot and put it back on between drives. A thumb stick stuck in the ground will keep the mud off your coat !

Sorry about the echo ????

It can also be caused by poor gun mounting, due to increased clothing when game shooting. If you have another lesson booked, then take your game shooting jacket and get the Instructor to check your gunfit WEARING THAT JACKET. All the gunmounting practice goes out of the window if you put on a heavy and bulky coat which effectively lengthens your stock by aroiund 1". I remember a guest gun on my shoot who shot very badly in the morning, far below what he was capable of. I asked him at lunch what the problem was, his face was showing a red welt on his cheek. He went on to explain that he was wearing his 'new' shooting coat. I asked if he had the 'old' coat with him, the answer was 'yes'. A change of coat and he hardly missed a bird all afternoon. The old coat had been through the washing machine so many times, the padded lining had well sunk. The new coat had a thick lining. If all else fails take your coat off to shoot and put it back on between drives. A thumb stick stuck in the ground will keep the mud off your coat !

P.S. If you are shooting 80% at clays, I would suggest there aint a great deal wrong with your shooting !

 

[chippy]

It can also be caused by poor gun mounting, due to increased clothing when game shooting. If you have another lesson booked, then take your game shooting jacket and get the Instructor to check your gunfit WEARING THAT JACKET. All the gunmounting practice goes out of the window if you put on a heavy and bulky coat which effectively lengthens your stock by aroiund 1". I remember a guest gun on my shoot who shot very badly in the morning, far below what he was capable of. I asked him at lunch what the problem was, his face was showing a red welt on his cheek. He went on to explain that he was wearing his 'new' shooting coat. I asked if he had the 'old' coat with him, the answer was 'yes'. A change of coat and he hardle missed a bird all afternoon. The old coat had been through the washing machine so many times, the padded lining had well sunk. The new coat had a thick lining. If all else fails take your coat off to shoot and put it back on between drives. A thumb stick stuck in the ground will keep the mud off your coat !

thicker clothing = longer stock = lower stock.

 

[westley]

thicker clothing = longer stock = lower stock.

Correct, BUT rather than shorten the gun, which could make it too short for clays, lessen the game shooting clothing. I tend to use the thin but warm Marino wool base layers, then shirt and tie then sweater and waistcoat (like your skeet vest but smarter). I have a waterproof sweater by Barbour which will withstand light rain and showers, if heavy rain, my Musto highland jacket and remove heavy sweater. Musto waterproof breeks take care of the nether regions. Try to keep the thickness of clothing to a minimum, after all, for the last 4/5 years I have been in shirt sleeves on dry days ! You may also consider thick and thin recoil pads. Try the Beretta 'gel' pads, they can be fitted and removed in seconds, without screws.