Beretta 694 barrel regulation - can it be adjusted?

[Robden]

I thought that any shotgun barrels, whether o/u or s/s should converge at about 40yds.

 

[Jonny English]

I can't help but think that the OP is looking at this too closely, where the rib points and where the gun shoots when mounted are two completely different things. If the gun shoots where you're looking, happy days. If you watch any major manufacturer make a set of barrels it's a pretty crude process. Sometimes it pays not to look at things too exactly, and just chuck lead down the barrel.

 

[Luke_(NL)]

Hi Pal

I take you had no issues closing the gun?. I sort of expected the cap end to resemble a snap cap so you could release the firing pins after breaking the gun open?

I believe mine are like that indeed, but it's been a while since using them last. I don't really understand why you would want to pull the trigger though, as the laser is on until you take the cartridge out anyways.

 

[Luke_(NL)]

I thought that any shotgun barrels, whether o/u or s/s should converge at about 40yds.

That seems like a lot of distance, but maybe true if you look at the imaginary center of bore-line. As we shoot shot, in reality the spread will only be marginally different between top and bottom barrel and flight paths will overlap way sooner than at 40 yrds from bore.

 

[cheeko]

I can't help but think that the OP is looking at this too closely, where the rib points and where the gun shoots when mounted are two completely different things. If the gun shoots where you're looking, happy days. If you watch any major manufacturer make a set of barrels it's a pretty crude process. Sometimes it pays not to look at things too exactly, and just chuck lead down the barrel.

Of course they (POA an POI) are two different things but the rib and bead are there for a reason: to set your POA.
That POA should be where the POI will be, without having to adjust the comb left, right up or down.
We pay for barrels to be regulated.
How can you justify an over barrel who's POI is so different from the under barrel, especially when shooting doubles?
Can you react fast anough to remember "hey, i have to point high-left of the first clay and low right of the second to smash them".
I shoot at least twice a week.
I want 25s every time I shoot.
I average 90% the past 3 years and was hoping this would be my 16-22 yard and doubles gun.
I have 4 other shotguns, two of which are O/Us.
They are both spot on at 25 and 40 yards.
One is a Browning 725 Pro Trap (>$5.5k CAN funds) and the other is a Canuck O/U Combo (~$1.9k CAN funds).
To pay $6.5k for a Beretta and have two barrels so far off is not acceptable, in my books, anyway.
To each their own.
Here is a video from the Kolar factory, note the barrel regulation check towards the end.
I have cued it up near the barrel pattern test:

 

[cheeko]

I can't help but think that the OP is looking at this too closely, where the rib points and where the gun shoots when mounted are two completely different things. If the gun shoots where you're looking, happy days. If you watch any major manufacturer make a set of barrels it's a pretty crude process. Sometimes it pays not to look at things too exactly, and just chuck lead down the barrel.

Look at this crap from Beretta, brand new in the box A400 Xcel MultiTarget.
Over $4k CAN funds with kick-off and B-fast.
The rib was welded at least 5 degrees off center of the barrel!!!
Whiskey tango foxtrot???
Needless to say, that gun was returned pronto.
Got a new one and the frikken rear rib screw fell out after a few hundred rounds.
A new screw is $20 USD.
What's up, Beretta???
i know many manufacturers, world-wide, are having a hard time finding and keeping good, experienced employees.
But they should maintain a stringent quality assurance test before delivering to Customers, DT11 or not.
Thanks for letting me vent.

Carry on now please.

 

[Paul120]

Of course they (POA an POI) are two different things but the rib and bead are there for a reason: to set your POA.
That POA should be where the POI will be, without having to adjust the comb left, right up or down.
We pay for barrels to be regulated.
How can you justify an over barrel who's POI is so different from the under barrel, especially when shooting doubles?
Can you react fast anough to remember "hey, i have to point high-left of the first clay and low right of the second to smash them".
I shoot at least twice a week.
I want 25s every time I shoot.
I average 90% the past 3 years and was hoping this would be my 16-22 yard and doubles gun.
I have 4 other shotguns, two of which are O/Us.
They are both spot on at 25 and 40 yards.
One is a Browning 725 Pro Trap (>$5.5k CAN funds) and the other is a Canuck O/U Combo (~$1.9k CAN funds).
To pay $6.5k for a Beretta and have two barrels so far off is not acceptable, in my books, anyway.
To each their own.
Here is a video from the Kolar factory, note the barrel regulation check towards the end.
I have cued it up near the barrel pattern test:

I believe that Perazzi pride themselves on regulation are one of the best at it. Belgian Brownings are are patterned on a plate and have to be spot on before they are allowed to leave the factory. Infact new guns have generally always come with the pattern sheets in the box.
The japanise Brownings/Mirokus also have high QC standards. But that's Japan for you, they pride themselves on QC

There was a story about gearboxes and engine made in Japan lasting twice as long as the Identical model made in the USA.
When they investigated why they found the machining and build tolerances were much better.

 

[Stiggers]

Every day is a school day mate - thank you

I believe mine are like that indeed, but it's been a while since using them last. I don't really understand why you would want to pull the trigger though, as the laser is on until you take the cartridge out anyways.

Not looking to pull the trigger mate, just aware that the pins would need to released after putting the cartridge in, besides which you cannot activate the laser manually, which is why I was really keen on the Arrow Laser Shot as it came with a micro switch that allowed you to activate the dot, so if you wanted to check alignment when bring the gun up against a basic target it was great - make adjustment and repeat etc

 

[Martinj]

I think most of them are permanently on. With mine at least I put the batteries in and screw up the end cap until the laser comes on, I do what I need to do then remove it and undo the battery cap so the laser turns off and that's how I store it.

 

[mpmilo]

Same as above with mine ^^

 

[cheeko]

I think most of them are permanently on. With mine at least I put the batteries in and screw up the end cap until the laser comes on, I do what I need to do then remove it and undo the battery cap so the laser turns off and that's how I store it.

Same as above with mine ^^

Ditto here.
Unscrew primer side, put batts in, laser on.
Must remove batts when done.

 

[PhilR]

I believe that Perazzi pride themselves on regulation are one of the best at it. Belgian Brownings are are patterned on a plate and have to be spot on before they are allowed to leave the factory. Infact new guns have generally always come with the pattern sheets in the box.
The japanise Brownings/Mirokus also have high QC standards. But that's Japan for you, they pride themselves on QC

There was a story about gearboxes and engine made in Japan lasting twice as long as the Identical model made in the USA.
When they investigated why they found the machining and build tolerances were much better.

I've still got the original cardboard box my 1970 Browning A1 skeet gun came in, complete with the two factory shot pattern test sheets.

 

[Luke_(NL)]

The rib was welded at least 5 degrees off center of the barrel!!!

Hard to tell, but from the pictures it looks like the rear "ramp" up to the rib sits left of where it should be. Either way, wholly unacceptable for it to leave a store or factory like that.

 

[cheeko]

Hard to tell, but from the pictures it looks like the rear "ramp" up to the rib sits left of where it should be. Either way, wholly unacceptable for it to leave a store or factory like that.

I know, the pictures don't make it very clear.
I'm not a great photographer I guess but it was the barrel rib that was off, not the rear ramp.
When i took it to where I bought it from (2.5 hr drive one-way), they assembled the A400 same as I did and their jaws dropped LOL.
Luckily, they had another A400 Xcel MT in stock and threw in a couple choke tubes for my troubles.

 

[TRINITY]

Regarding those laser cartridges, I bought one . I set the gun up and marked the point where the laser was on a wall about 15 yards away. I then did a second test and rotated the laser in the gun and the point moved.

In summary, I would not trust a laser sight

 

[Bavarian]

Same here. Bought one for the shotgun and one for one of my rifles to set up the scope roughly. Did not work at all.
The one for the shotgun can be used for some indoor training, but that's it.

 

[Luke_(NL)]

Same here. Bought one for the shotgun and one for one of my rifles to set up the scope roughly. Did not work at all.
The one for the shotgun can be used for some indoor training, but that's it.

I can see how the shotgun one can have play and point out the barrel less than straight, but I would have thought that through a rifle barrel it couldn't really beam out of alignment, unless you have a pretty big caliber in really short barrel... No pun intended, I promise.

 

[cheeko]

Regarding those laser cartridges, I bought one . I set the gun up and marked the point where the laser was on a wall about 15 yards away. I then did a second test and rotated the laser in the gun and the point moved.

In summary, I would not trust a laser sight

I did the same and the point stayed in the same spot.
So I guess it depends on who manufactured the laser and how tight their machining tolerances are.

 

[cheeko]

I can't help but think that the OP is looking at this too closely, where the rib points and where the gun shoots when mounted are two completely different things. If the gun shoots where you're looking, happy days. If you watch any major manufacturer make a set of barrels it's a pretty crude process. Sometimes it pays not to look at things too exactly, and just chuck lead down the barrel.

Here you go from Krieghoff.
Pretty crude but spot-on POI.

 

[Trapped]

In no order of significance:
1 Shotgun sights are crude
2 Contact between fore-end and lower barrel, especially when hot, affects point of impact
3 Ditto - even more so - when a bench rest is used
4 Cartridge-mounted lasers are dimensionally inconsistent
5 Two muzzle-mounted lasers, with stable bore contact, can indicate if bores are parallel. (A famous Italian OT gunmaker used to have difficulty in this area.)
6 A gun, first bench-rested, then shot off the shoulder, will have different points of impact
7 A mid-bead can be helpful, but the rib may not be parallel to the bores
8 Different cartridges shoot to different points
9 Gun fit, especially of the comb, is a major factor in 'accuracy'
And so on.