First Gun

[Andrew01]

I have just come into the sport and I’m looking for my first gun.

I want something that will take me through the learning curve and last for a good few years afterwards.

I don’t really want to keep chopping and changing my gun constantly.

Having done a bit of research, this has come up and I’m quite keen on it , Webley and Scott 912XS

I will be shooting clays a couple of times a month , 100 or so at a time .

Opinions on it as a first / long term gun ?

 

[jasper]

Hi Andrew. I'm not sure how many replies you will get on here regarding the Wembley and Scott. Don't think they are that popular. Which doesn't mean they won't suit your needs. Just that not many will have experience  to pass on. 

Jasper. 

 

[Chrisessig]

Looks real nice

 

[Andrew01]

Hi Andrew. I'm not sure how many replies you will get on here regarding the Wembley and Scott. Don't think they are that popular. Which doesn't mean they won't suit your needs. Just that not many will have experience  to pass on. 

Jasper. 

Hi Jasper.

I had a very in depth conversation yesterday with somebody who works at a  local shooting ground and was advised away from Webley and Scott.

The person concerned was of the opinion that they aren't made particularly well these days and if my budget is in the £5-800 bracket and my preference is new or as near to new as possible then there are plenty of great guns in the ATA, Yildiz, Kofs and Huglu ranges to choose from.

The person I spoke to has no particular loyalty to any brand as he can source pretty much any make and model of gun within 48 hours, which was refreshing to hear as I have felt a bit railroaded towards certain brands and models having spoken to local RFD's , I will be going to have a few lessons once I'm covid free and will get a chance to find out which gun both suits and fits me best.

 

[Westward]

You say you don't want to keep chopping and changing guns which is fair enough but almost everyone changes their starting out gun within a year or 2 so my first suggestion would be don't buy a new gun. 

The Turkish made guns, which is all of those you mentioned above, are reasonable value and probably okay for a couple of hundred clays a month for a few years, and from a reliability point of view I doubt there's much to choose between them.

My 2nd suggestion is to check the overall weight of whatever gun you look seriously at for sporting clays and avoid any that weigh less than 8lbs (3.6Kg). 

 

[Scotty]

Sorry to jump on a thread but I finally got my licence through a month ago and so I'm in the new gun boat as well.

I'm also feeling torn between new and second hand, more expensive or cheaper starter gun.

I just want to politely challenge the notion that it's commonplace to change a gun after a year. Is it possible that people change because they've started out on a cheaper platform to begin with?

I understand the need to develop a consistent mount, but wouldn't a higher quality adjustable gun put off the need to change quite so quickly? I'm all in a quandary!

I was swaying towards a Yildiz pro adjustable to hope it would grow with me. Or at least I could grow into it! But I would have thought a second hand adjustable model from any of the big stables would be better than a cheaper new gun you plan on changing quickly?

 

[Will Hewland]

This forum really needs a beginners guide, as per the gospel according to the experienced and relatively successful shooters on here, as the same advice applies each time a beginner appears. (Glad to see beginners appear btw, but the advice is the same year in year out). 
 

Re the first gun, rather than a very cheap new one, a good used Beretta, Browning, Miroku etc is the way to go for several reasons:

* They are reliable. Guns aren’t like cars, a few miles and older model are fine  

* They aren’t mad money and will re-sell for nearly what you paid

* They will handle well, have decent triggers and usually be a sensible weight, unlike many new cheap guns. This is important as it will help shape your style while you learn.

* Because you will see lots of good shooters using similar guns you won’t have a mental breakdown worrying about your gun choice. 

* After a year you will very likely want a change of gun, either out of curiosity, possibly for a good gun fit reason or from a deep belief that the new gun will transform your shooting (ha ha). So the trade-in ease is a big deal. 
 

A complete beginners guide will be way longer than just about gun choice, but hopefully the above explains that small part. 

 

[Charliedog]

Sorry to jump on a thread but I finally got my licence through a month ago and so I'm in the new gun boat as well.

I'm also feeling torn between new and second hand, more expensive or cheaper starter gun.

I just want to politely challenge the notion that it's commonplace to change a gun after a year. Is it possible that people change because they've started out on a cheaper platform to begin with?

I understand the need to develop a consistent mount, but wouldn't a higher quality adjustable gun put off the need to change quite so quickly? I'm all in a quandary!

I was swaying towards a Yildiz pro adjustable to hope it would grow with me. Or at least I could grow into it! But I would have thought a second hand adjustable model from any of the big stables would be better than a cheaper new gun you plan on changing quickly?

I kept my first gun for 5 years (725 sporter adjustable) which I purchased new and could have happily carried on shooting that, only changed through temptation and did not improve my scores, but I miss in style now

 

[Westward]

Good post by Will.

Financially speaking you will pay 20% VAT on a new gun which is lost the moment you hand over your card. With a used gun from a dealer you still have VAT but only on their gross profit so you gain a bit when you buy it and again when you sell because depreciation on a used gun is usually small, especially if it's a desirable brand and you look after it.

 

[Bavarian]

I would also go for a used gun from a well known brand. Here are some Beretta 686s around which are heavily used for beginners training on one ground and

some Browning 525s at the other ground. Both with "just enough" maintenance and they are doing a good job for years.

Spare parts are no problem to find and also a gusnmith who can take care of those guns is not hard to find.

 

[Freddypip]

Will’s advice is spot on and as he says it ought to be on a sticky.

I would add a few points to it but their weight varies from person to person.

An adjustable comb on a first gun is generally helpful but don’t mess with it once it is setup.

Since the start of CNC, gun quality has risen. Most guns post 2000 should be reasonably reliable. As a first gun I would prefer this Webley & Scott to a 1970’s Browning B25 Custom for reliability any day.

200 a month is 2,500 a year. Most guns need little or no servicing up to 20/30k. A 686 is good for 50k between new U bolts and will shoot 200k ish before its dead on its feet. I will be well past shooting before mine really needs replacing. That Webley & Scott should work fine.

Money is relative. Assume you will loose £300 when you trade it in (and much more on a new gun). If it’s £800/900 and you are the sentimental type you will not trade it anyway. Everyone likes a spare (particularly if it has an adjustable comb).

It you pick it up, it fits and feel right, it’s probably worth getting.

Nobody can really tell you what a gun is like long term. Things change. What we do know is that Berettas, Brownings and Mirokus keep their value and have the respect of all those in the know.

 

[ColinD]

Well I don't know about repected makes and you'll get a good deal when you trade in, most dealers I've meet seem to want to offer you well below the price then stick 500/600 on it when they come to sell. I know everyone has to make a living but don't belive you get back close to what you paid when you come to trade it in

 

[El Spavo]

Bought my 525 for a grand about 3 years ago... still have it, not planning on swapping/trading up, and pretty much expect to get a grand for it if I sold it private if I ever got bored of it.

By example, I think that is in-line with absolutely everything written above!

 

[Richard59]

Well I don't know about repected makes and you'll get a good deal when you trade in, most dealers I've meet seem to want to offer you well below the price then stick 500/600 on it when they come to sell. I know everyone has to make a living but don't belive you get back close to what you paid when you come to trade it in

As with all things shooting, lots of variables, moi had a SHand 687, bought £1100, 6 years later PXd at £1000, SHand 682 Gold E bought £1400, 4 years later PXd it for £1300 ( and look at the prices of these now, near original list price some) a SHand DT10 was bought £2700 sold 6 months later (we really did not get on) to a dealer straight £2000 cash, so in near 11 years of shooting it’s cost me £900 in “lost” value, now if I’d kept the 682 that would have been £100! 
Oh and the DT went and I bought a second hand 30” MK38 Trap for a £1000 (think 6years ago) I’d most probably get that if I wanted to move it on. Been lucky, all the above were / are SHand guns bought & mostly sold (after years) and not lost much, I’d hate to think of how much I’ve “invested” in cartridges & entries in the same time.

 

[ColinD]

The way inflation go's with most gun related buys the longer you keep the the less you loose DT11 for instance, how many keep their first gun more than a year, people always say to first gun buyers you wont loose a lot on that when you trade it in, when they paid £1200 for it and get £700 in a trade 6 months down the line