Fixed choke - opening it up!

[Bebo]

however usable or not the shot string is and how ever short or long and however few milliseconds it takes to pass I would still rather miss ever so slightly in front, just in case ?

It's more frustrating missing in front than behind!  Had a stand this morning where I was missing a crosser and gradually stretching the lead out.  Wasn't till the last pair that I reined it back in and hit it.  

 

[Will Hewland]

It's more frustrating missing in front than behind!  Had a stand this morning where I was missing a crosser and gradually stretching the lead out.  Wasn't till the last pair that I reined it back in and hit it.  

Getting off topic, but it's VERY common for people after about a year or 18 months of shooting to start getting in front of everything. I see it all the time and did it myself. Back then, I took a sudden step forward by giving everything a bit less than I wanted too. Even now, I rarely miss behind, it's usually too much.

 

[ips]

my point is a miss behind is a miss for sure BUT even if the shot string is so fast and relatively useless and even if its a mere inch of travel in the target in reality it is still a shot string and the clay or bird COULD just catch the end ....but only if you effectively miss in front. I am not promoting a deliberate miss in front just saying that if you did !!!!!!

 

[ChrisPackham]

I always over lead, drives me mad..

 

[Will Hewland]

my point is a miss behind is a miss for sure BUT even if the shot string is so fast and relatively useless and even if its a mere inch of travel in the target in reality it is still a shot string and the clay or bird COULD just catch the end ....but only if you effectively miss in front. I am not promoting a deliberate miss in front just saying that if you did !!!!!!

Can't fault your logic, but it's no basis for a game plan or solid method. Might find you the odd chip if lucky.

 

[ips]

Getting off topic, but it's VERY common for people after about a year of 18 months of shooting to start getting in front of everything. I see it all the time and did it myself. Back then, I took a sudden step forward by giving everything a bit less than I wanted too. Even now, I rarely miss behind, it's usually too much.

I recently stood behind someone shooting pheasant, he was in front of everything he was giving it a quantifiable lead (in his head) I advised that he kept the gun moving but shot AT the bird. He started hitting them, well more than he was. My point is, everyone see's lead differently

 

[Bebo]

Getting off topic, but it's VERY common for people after about a year or 18 months of shooting to start getting in front of everything. I see it all the time and did it myself. Back then, I took a sudden step forward by giving everything a bit less than I wanted too. Even now, I rarely miss behind, it's usually too much.

Been shooting about four years, but I do suffer from missing in front on slower targets and on dropping targets as well.  I tend to do it more at the local shoots I go to, particularly after I've been to a Registered shoot or to a ground that puts on bigger targets.  I suppose I get into the habit of pushing out the lead a bit and then forget to tone it down again.

 

[Will Hewland]

I recently stood behind someone shooting pheasant, he was in front of everything he was giving it a quantifiable lead (in his head) I advised that he kept the gun moving but shot AT the bird. He started hitting them, well more than he was. My point is, everyone see's lead differently

That is a whole other topic, but yes. Of course I like to argue that you either see it correctly as I do, or in some other silly way. ?

 

[balltrap]

I am a terrible game shot i over lead everything unless its going away

 

[ips]

Can't fault your logic, but it's no basis for a game plan or solid method. Might find you the odd chip if lucky.

exactly will, as I say not suggesting a game plan just adding my thoughts on the "science" however little difference shot string may make it is still a shot string ?

ps

there is nothing better on a cold wet Sunday than a POI, POA, or shot string debate, apart from cartridge quality antimony and chokes of course ?

That is a whole other topic, but yes. Of course I like to argue that you either see it correctly as I do, or in some other silly way. ?

indeed. I dont see lead i dont see how anyone has the time to work it out particularily snap shooting.

 

[Will Hewland]

Been shooting about four years, but I do suffer from missing in front on slower targets and on dropping targets as well.  I tend to do it more at the local shoots I go to, particularly after I've been to a Registered shoot or to a ground that puts on bigger targets.  I suppose I get into the habit of pushing out the lead a bit and then forget to tone it down again.

Yes, the other thing that people fail to appreciate (and this nearly gets us back on the original topic) is that shot slows down massively. The muzzle speed we read on our cartridge box only exists at the muzzle (as indicated). 30 yards out its less than half that speed. My point is, on very close stuff (within 6 or 7 yards) the shot speed is very fast and therefore you really need next to no lead. Most of us have sussed that close rabbits need 'nothing' but the main reason is the closeness and almost instant muzzle to target shot-time.

 

[ips]

I am a terrible game shot i over lead everything unless its going away

no, your just a terrible shot ?

only joking of course. Seriously though, your a fine all round shot and sporting was I believe your passion at one time so why do you think it is that you struggle with feather but hit the same target presented in clay ??

 

[balltrap]

Reading the speed of a clay is far easier to me than a bird plus clays usually go  a lot faster

 

[ips]

um, interesting.

even though the bird is a much bigger thing than a midi. ???

must admit watching driven pheasant from behind the gun looks very easy indeed. Look down the barrel (so to speak) and they look much smaller and faster. Same can be said for clays though ?

 

[westley]

So your playing with 4 inch at 9 yards

Yes, he has long arms   !             

Therein lies the problem, if.

Almost all tope end shooters rely on their ability to place the pattern accurately in the first place hence it makes no difference to them but to believe we can all do so is false news. Incidentally hasn't GD got himself a set of 1/4 choke barrels for this very reason ? 

YES,   he took my advice, after a bit of persuading !         

 

[balltrap]

Yes, he has long arms   !             

YES,   he took my advice, after a bit of persuading !         




 

You mean somebody actually listened to you

 

[Hamster]

my point is a miss behind is a miss for sure BUT even if the shot string is so fast and relatively useless and even if its a mere inch of travel in the target in reality it is still a shot string and the clay or bird COULD just catch the end ....but only if you effectively miss in front. I am not promoting a deliberate miss in front just saying that if you did !!!!!!

Not really so, sorry. The bit that people seem to not quite get (respectfully) is that the whole thing is a statistical game of probabilities, what this means is that if you're prepared to believe that a late "lucky" pellet is waiting to head butt the clay then statistically in another sequence on a different day or different shot another "unlucky" pellet will by definition duck out of the way of the clay, leading to a miss. 

The only way to ensure you avoid misses is to place the centre of a dense pattern on the clay, we get away with murder on closer shots but fairly easily miss the distant ones because of this simple rule. 

 

[ips]

cant argue with the last bit Hamid ?

will have to give the other bit some thought before I admit defeat ?

 

[Hamster]

cant argue with the last bit Hamid ?

will have to give the other bit some thought before I admit defeat ?

What I'm saying is that during that 5" max length of travel that Will so ably told us about, the clay can just as easily get out of the way of a pellet than run into another - statistically speaking, hence shot string is all but meaningless. 

 

[Mutley]

http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/gun-nuts/2011/08/measuring-shot-string-high-speed-video