bostonmick
Well-known member
I have no problem paying a decent price for a decent service.however I fail to see that the increase being proposed is going to do any good as far as service levels go.
Home Office proposals and survey - BASC
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Just out of interest peeps.......... and this is a made up situation ....but....what would be your reactions if for example in 1 years time the following came out.....what would you do....pay up or give up shooting.
1. SCG is now going to be £500 (£1.37p per day) to apply for and £200 to renew. (£0.54p per day)
2. The SCG lasts for 2 years.
3. The EFP is now going to be a charge (instead of free) and it will be £100 (£0.27p)
4. You now have to provide and pay for your own medical certification £80 (£0.22p)
£2.40 a day does not look much does it...........but £680 at the time........how many new shooters would come into the sport having to pay that as a lump sum.
And in 5 or 10 years....what will be the costs then....once everyone agrees readily.....to these rises.........baby .....bath water.....
Long term strategists will understand what i am trying to say.
Charges.......the easiest way to stop our sport being a sport for all.
1. SCG is now going to be £500 (£1.37p per day) to apply for and £200 to renew. (£0.54p per day)
2. The SCG lasts for 2 years.
3. The EFP is now going to be a charge (instead of free) and it will be £100 (£0.27p)
4. You now have to provide and pay for your own medical certification £80 (£0.22p)
£2.40 a day does not look much does it...........but £680 at the time........how many new shooters would come into the sport having to pay that as a lump sum.
And in 5 or 10 years....what will be the costs then....once everyone agrees readily.....to these rises.........baby .....bath water.....
Long term strategists will understand what i am trying to say.
Charges.......the easiest way to stop our sport being a sport for all.
tiptop
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Nobody likes price rises on anything, but how much would the cost have to rise before people say bollox to it, and give up the sport they enjoy.The future is all hypothetical as nobody knows what that will bring.
As for the other costs EFP only if you want to shoot in Europe.
I currently hold a driving licence that i have to pay for a medical, if i want to keep it, and other people that hold that licence have been doing it for donkies years, and have to pay go to school to keep it. But as i haven't used it for a while it will be going on the back burner this Feb.
In the context of the cost of shooting (weekly/monthly), mmm.... people will have to make their own minds up. Its always the lump sum that makes it look worse, thats why people moan about shells etc, because of the outlay for 1000+ at a time.
People that want to hold a SGC should be aware that there are quit a few lump sums that they will have to be paying out.
I think there are to many alarmist on either side of the fence when it comes to shooting.
I'm not for or aginst the rise in cost as long as we get the value and service, for the price we pay. Whatever that may be.
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It is the lump sum that matters because you cannot pay it on the tick. Hence when it gets too high.....you will see numbers of participants drop.
Already people moan about cartridge prices or shoot prices.
Like you I am not fussed either way as it would not stop me shooting.
But long term strategy on both sides of the fence is important especially when part of it is political
Already people moan about cartridge prices or shoot prices.
Like you I am not fussed either way as it would not stop me shooting.
But long term strategy on both sides of the fence is important especially when part of it is political
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I can also understand the people who say that EFP does not matter to them.
But when looking at the bigger picture for the health and acceptance of shooting as a credible sport. The EPF is very important.
It is the essential part of getting abroad to shoot international shoots and win the prizes for GBR that get the sport recognised.
The local registered shoot ain't going to do that.
In shooting we have many people who only look at the local picture and not always realise the importance of the bigger picture...or the politics of the bigger pictures. That is not any criticism...it is just the fact of them not having being involved in those things.
But when looking at the bigger picture for the health and acceptance of shooting as a credible sport. The EPF is very important.
It is the essential part of getting abroad to shoot international shoots and win the prizes for GBR that get the sport recognised.
The local registered shoot ain't going to do that.
In shooting we have many people who only look at the local picture and not always realise the importance of the bigger picture...or the politics of the bigger pictures. That is not any criticism...it is just the fact of them not having being involved in those things.
RobertBeard
Moderator
I did the same before I saw your post but made the comment that we cannot make an obvious choice until there is clarity over who is to pay for any required medical reports as they should not get both in my view I.e. An increase and shooters having to pay for medical reports seeing as they are trying it on in various counties!
Just had a thought - how much is a driving licence and how long does it last - that gives you the privelege of being in charge of a lethal weapon for a very long time.
Police should also benefit from computerisation of the licensing process
Don't see why section 5's should have their licences for free!
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Jan Powell
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It's a fair increase given the cost of the licensing process and the pressure police budgets are under at the moment. Who knows, it may even weed out some if the undesirables.
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no.1topdog
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By "undesirable" do you mean those of us that don't have large amounts of disposable income?
Please don't let this become an elitist issue and remember some of us are not as fortunate as you obviously are.
Just because I can't shoot as frequently as some doesn't mean I am not as passionate about my sport as you . I still stand up to be counted in support of shooting and you can ill afford to lose people like me.
Bryn12
Well-known member
Remember the licence is required by keepers & underkeepers, shepherds &etc to do their job. Ideally their employers would subsidise their licences but I think I'm be more likely to see an airborne Tamworth, especially as most big farming/sporting estates are run by factors nowadays.
I can afford the co-terminus lump sum but if I couldn't do it one hit I'd be thinking about putting something aside every week month to cover it.
I can afford the co-terminus lump sum but if I couldn't do it one hit I'd be thinking about putting something aside every week month to cover it.
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Says a policeman :wink:
And the true reason........pressure on police budgets :laugh:
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Then the next year another problem is found and you find yourself at £1000.
I have been seeing exactly what 'people said would not be allowed to happen'.......happen.......in the Legal Aid field.
Cuts after cuts after cuts.....God help you if you need defending in any case that goes to Court......because you are feeked these days.
But that is another story.....that again people will only realise when it happens to them.
I have been seeing exactly what 'people said would not be allowed to happen'.......happen.......in the Legal Aid field.
Cuts after cuts after cuts.....God help you if you need defending in any case that goes to Court......because you are feeked these days.
But that is another story.....that again people will only realise when it happens to them.
Nimbusgb
Well-known member
Seems like fair pricing really.
Disagree on the cost of a visitors permit though. If it takes £88 to investigate a new shotgun certificate why is it so much cheaper to get a visitors permit? The applicant is overseas for a start, just one or two communications and the £20 is in the bin!
Disagree on the cost of a visitors permit though. If it takes £88 to investigate a new shotgun certificate why is it so much cheaper to get a visitors permit? The applicant is overseas for a start, just one or two communications and the £20 is in the bin!
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HDAV
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It is the lump sum that matters because you cannot pay it on the tick.
Jim Wheeler
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a visitor permit is issued to an existing gun licence holder. there is some trust between countries as far as sporting kit is concerned I expect.
on the OP`s original issue, don`t forget that a ridiculous increase will make it also most likely to close down most shooting grounds, the s/hand value of not just shotguns, but also everthing else including farms , Moors , will drop substantially,, not to mention gun makers, gun shops, and employees throughout the allied industries,, some one million sgc holders reduced to 20,000?. the mind boggles. but it won`t happen.
on the OP`s original issue, don`t forget that a ridiculous increase will make it also most likely to close down most shooting grounds, the s/hand value of not just shotguns, but also everthing else including farms , Moors , will drop substantially,, not to mention gun makers, gun shops, and employees throughout the allied industries,, some one million sgc holders reduced to 20,000?. the mind boggles. but it won`t happen.
HDAV
Well-known member
If only there were 1 million of 650k ish I think total SGC on issue and a few hundred thousand FAC with ma y holding both...... If there 3-4 million of us we might have some mandate on a national level..... But one % of the population......
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I cannot understand most of what HGV posts or is it what is known as text speak and we have to guess the missing letters????
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I said I was out of date...with 1 million certificates (SGC and FAC).
But even with the above quoted 650,000 only a max of 30,000 are in a clay shooting organisation and max 140,000 (including some from clay organisations) are in Basc. The majority are in 'nothing'.......hence overall the voices of the organisations are weak.
With the SNP starting an attack on shooting estates......the long term strategists see the future as being interesting :wink:
The fast asleep shooters will only wake up when there are no more concessions to give....and all the grounds near them no longer exist....and the cost of playing this sport is prohibitive to newcomers.
Entry point into archery £4.00 / hour including kit.
Entry point into shooting £40-120 / hour plus clays and cartridges.
You would really have to be keen to try more than once.....or have good money...or good parents....or.....or......or........passion.
(I consider myself lucky getting into it many years ago when it was a lot cheaper...especially game shooting. So I am hooked now thanks to all the good and bad times) #filledmyboots
But even with the above quoted 650,000 only a max of 30,000 are in a clay shooting organisation and max 140,000 (including some from clay organisations) are in Basc. The majority are in 'nothing'.......hence overall the voices of the organisations are weak.
With the SNP starting an attack on shooting estates......the long term strategists see the future as being interesting :wink:
The fast asleep shooters will only wake up when there are no more concessions to give....and all the grounds near them no longer exist....and the cost of playing this sport is prohibitive to newcomers.
Entry point into archery £4.00 / hour including kit.
Entry point into shooting £40-120 / hour plus clays and cartridges.
You would really have to be keen to try more than once.....or have good money...or good parents....or.....or......or........passion.
(I consider myself lucky getting into it many years ago when it was a lot cheaper...especially game shooting. So I am hooked now thanks to all the good and bad times) #filledmyboots
RobertBeard
Moderator
Small-bore Target shooting is also cheap to get into at about £5 to £10 at a club for a taster session and free coaching in a lot of cases. There are a few commercial guys around but only the elite probably use them.
Full-bore target shooting is dearer as the range and ammo costs are much dearer but again coaches tend to be experienced club shooters passing on their knowledge.
In any market you charge what the market will bear if you are giving value. Plenty seem to be doing fine charging so its like golf there is plenty of room for pros charging for their expertise.
