Cartridges , value for money versus cost

[Daz W]

I tried a few Fiocchi today. Just my quick opinions:
 

Only a couple of FBlacks on a close target just to feel the recoil, which seemed Ok actually, better than I recall from old days. 
 

Just a couple of F3 pistons to see how they felt. Smooth recoil I thought. I’m not convinced about the pattern, as the outer spreading part is uneven, but a perfectly usable shell. 

I shot about 6 FBlus and the recoil is fine. Not smooth, with a quick “crack” type feel, but not too high. Certainly a cartridge that I don’t think you could go very wrong with especially if they remain decent value. 

I've just read this:

https://sportingshooter.co.uk/article/cartridge-review-fiocchi-f-black

It would appear the FBlack is a harder recoiling FBlu, and was designed to help cycling a semi auto. Makes me wonder why Fiocchi only do FBlu in 7.5 plaswad, when FBlack is available in 8.5 & 7.5 plaswad and 8 uk fibre? I think a FBlu continental 8.5 would be a really popular cartridge

 

[jasper]

It's so they can bang out millions of em without changing any machines etc. And buy or make one lot of components  by the trillion. Keeps the price down. Just don't  mention the super hard 5% antimony shot. 

Jasper. 

But yes fblu 8.5. Sign me up. 

 

[Jonny English]

Gamebore velocity plus have just gone up to £269 thousand at our local shop, along with all the other gamebore. Others brands still at the old prices yet.

 

[Charliedog]

I tried a few Fiocchi today. Just my quick opinions:
 

Only a couple of FBlacks on a close target just to feel the recoil, which seemed Ok actually, better than I recall from old days. 
 

Just a couple of F3 pistons to see how they felt. Smooth recoil I thought. I’m not convinced about the pattern, as the outer spreading part is uneven, but a perfectly usable shell. 

I shot about 6 FBlus and the recoil is fine. Not smooth, with a quick “crack” type feel, but not too high. Certainly a cartridge that I don’t think you could go very wrong with especially if they remain decent value. 

I have been using the F Black sporting in 8.5s for 90% of sporting targets and F Blu for the extreme stuff on a round, for me they did have a noticably different recoil feeling at first but got used to it very quickly and dont give them a second thought now, I am about 5,000 carts through the gun and the 8.5s are very good

 

[Scotty]

Sure, but when they are not, the boxes will be £9. It’s nuts not to buy 1000 at a time. 

Have you heard of the Vimes theory of economics?

"The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money.

Take boots, for example. He earned thirty-eight dollars a month plus allowances. A really good pair of leather boots cost fifty dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. Those were the kind of boots Vimes always bought, and wore until the soles were so thin that he could tell where he was in Ankh-Morpork on a foggy night by the feel of the cobbles.

But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford fifty dollars had a pair of boots that'd still be keeping his feet dry in ten years' time, while the poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent a hundred dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.

This was the Captain Samuel Vimes 'Boots' theory of socioeconomic unfairness."

Not everyone can buy by the the 1000 or even the slab. Especially not if your nervous wife signed off on there being a gun in the house as long as there was never ammo at the same time. Then that man would need to be either mad or some kind of hero to have smuggled a slab of pro ones up the attic too...

 

[Will Hewland]

Have you heard of the Vimes theory of economics?

"The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money.

Take boots, for example. He earned thirty-eight dollars a month plus allowances. A really good pair of leather boots cost fifty dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. Those were the kind of boots Vimes always bought, and wore until the soles were so thin that he could tell where he was in Ankh-Morpork on a foggy night by the feel of the cobbles.

But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford fifty dollars had a pair of boots that'd still be keeping his feet dry in ten years' time, while the poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent a hundred dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.

This was the Captain Samuel Vimes 'Boots' theory of socioeconomic unfairness."

Not everyone can buy by the the 1000 or even the slab. Especially not if your nervous wife signed off on there being a gun in the house as long as there was never ammo at the same time. Then that man would need to be either mad or some kind of hero to have smuggled a slab of pro ones up the attic too...

Absolutely. The poor pay more for everything, particularly when having to borrow and pay interest is involved. It’s called the poverty trap and it’s the same in business in lean times, you employ temporary measures that are good for cashflow now, but are way dearer long term than proper reinvestment etc.

I insist it’s possible to find people to share the 1000 rate though. I’ve come out of EJC with 1000 fibres when I wanted 250 and sold the rest in the car park. The wife thing is a pickle. I’d find a shooting mate to hold them for me, or even the shooting ground. 

 

[Scotty]

Indeed. The short term solution is never the best option.

This hypothetical hero is planning to win her over with her own shotgun and some Amber Hill's pink cartridges for her birthday.

 

[Will Hewland]

Indeed. The short term solution is never the best option.

This hypothetical hero is planning to win her over with her own shotgun and some Amber Hill's pink cartridges for her birthday.

I know some people are just so anti-gun that they become deaf and blind to reality. I would take her somewhere civilised like EJ Churchill for a have a go with a proper instructor. Very few people don’t enjoy it. 

 

[donna]

I know some people are just so anti-gun that they become deaf and blind to reality. I would take her somewhere civilised like EJ Churchill for a have a go with a proper instructor. Very few people don’t enjoy it. 

When Phil started shooting I was the same, not comfortable having a gun in the house even though it was locked up etc.  In the end I decided that I couldn’t moan about it if I hadn’t tried it BUT I insisted on a proper lesson,  not him taking me out Missed first rabbit out, hit the second, then third, then fourth and look at us now!  
 

But as Will said, take her to a decent ground which looks the part with a good instructor (Ben H works out of EJC and as a female shooter I can confidently say he is really good with female shooters and not as intimidating as you think!). Or Cheryl Hall would be good too.  Good luck!

 

[Bebo]

Can vouch for Cheryl Hall.  Spotted very quickly that my trigger flinch issue wasn't in my head, was down to gun fit. New stock that fits and it's gone. She coaches all over the place as well, which is good.

 

[Will Hewland]

I was thinking just one of their in house people for a first go would be more than fine to start and a “have a go” is a specific beginners thing they offer. 

 

[Bebo]

I was thinking just one of their in house people for a first go would be more than fine to start and a “have a go” is a specific beginners thing they offer. 

And Churchill's would be a good place for it, particularly if Scotty is driving and the champagne bar is open afterwards.

 

[ColinD]

Down range performance of the fblu is just not in question and they are considerably cheaper too. 

Jasper. 

Well they were, just hope that after what a dealer said to me they still will be. Fiocchi are upping their price 16%, Gamebore 20%, Hull are holding off at the moment, probably waiting for the others to catch them up 

No Fiocchi at the moment he can't get any he tells me

Edit Fblu's that is

 

[perazman]

Well they were, just hope that after what a dealer said to me they still will be. Fiocchi are upping their price 16%, Gamebore 20%, Hull are holding off at the moment, probably waiting for the others to catch them up 

No Fiocchi at the moment he can't get any he tells me

If those percentages are correct then that's insane! I can't believe Hull won't go up. They usually lead the field as far as price rises go.

I'd really hoped fiocchi wouldn't join the cartel. They've certainly increased their market share.

PM.

 

[ColinD]

I'm hoping he's wrong too, but  normally he been right so far

No FBlu's I wonder why, everybody seems to have the same idea at the moment, as you say I hope Fiocchi don't increase, as you say their market share must have risen sharply, you'd think that would tell them something

 

[Scotty]

And Churchill's would be a good place for it, particularly if Scotty is driving and the champagne bar is open afterwards.

I think I can go as far as a bacon roll and Styrofoam cup of tea.

Thankfully all those places are hours away from me.

 

[FESkent]

Well they were, just hope that after what a dealer said to me they still will be. Fiocchi are upping their price 16%, Gamebore 20%, Hull are holding off at the moment, probably waiting for the others to catch them up 

No Fiocchi at the moment he can't get any he tells me

Edit Fblu's that is

We sell Fiocchi and they have yet to issue a new price list so 16% is rumours rather than fact so far.

Continuity of supply has been a challenge due to the mess the world is in and demand for their products.

 

[philpot]

Some years ago, Beverly CTC now gone back to it's original name of East Yorks, used to sell Cheddite cartridges which at that time I had never even seen for sale before and whilst I didn't want to switch from the Fiocchi F-Blu, they were a decent shell as well as being well priced. Since the ground has been under Rob Hall's management they have not been in use there so no idea if they are still imported anymore or what the price is like now. I did find the little 21gr shell that my wife was using to be a cracking cartridge and possibly the best I tried.

 

[perazman]

Some years ago, Beverly CTC now gone back to it's original name of East Yorks, used to sell Cheddite cartridges which at that time I had never even seen for sale before and whilst I didn't want to switch from the Fiocchi F-Blu, they were a decent shell as well as being well priced. Since the ground has been under Rob Hall's management they have not been in use there so no idea if they are still imported anymore or what the price is like now. I did find the little 21gr shell that my wife was using to be a cracking cartridge and possibly the best I tried.

Cheddite are still alive and well in the UK. Imported by Malmo Guns based near Lancaster. Very nice folk to deal with.

Their top end shells are pricey but the Universals are an excellent all rounder. Currently £242 plas/£249 fibre. I may go back on them. I like the cheap fiocchis but supply is iffy.

PM.

 

[jasper]

Following the recent price hikes , there is no such thing as a cheap fiocchi. And I'm a fan. 

Had a chat with a gun room last week. Fiocchi are apparently  a nightmare to do buisness with at the moment. And Don't have what he wants. 

Shot the super sporting at Westfield today. Used some eley titanium strike from a job lot. Pretty nice cartridge. Great kills. OK recoil. But £350+ per k. No thanks. 

Jasper.