How many shooting grounds do you know of which have stopped doing Reg Comp's?
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Will Hewland
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Hi Nic,
The 20 refers specifically to their Reg shoots. It was the typical number in recent times.
I spoke to Teresa about it and she felt that sporting can work for them as a practice and corporate thing, so I am glad their effort on stands and so on will work for them. I would love to see them succeed in business, but they are right to pull the ESP reg shoot if it hurts their coffers.
A1's last five registered shoots have had 15, 11, 26, 16, 20 listed on the score sheet on the CPSA site. https://www.cpsa.co.uk/scores/fixtures/44/55606.
Shame really - I shot my first registered there, quite convenient for me to get to - but uninspiring targets and being squadded (one time with some people who gave me some stick) didn't really drag me back.
I will go back there from some Helice - Claudio and Teresa are good people, and the ground has a great potential being so close to London.
Shame really - I shot my first registered there, quite convenient for me to get to - but uninspiring targets and being squadded (one time with some people who gave me some stick) didn't really drag me back.
I will go back there from some Helice - Claudio and Teresa are good people, and the ground has a great potential being so close to London.
Will Hewland
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The potential was enormous I felt. In talks with Claudio, I raised the ideas of them running a sxs championship and a `Greater London Masters`.
Richard59
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Miss A6 as a ground, didn't shoot reg but when working around Manchester liked to practice a few skeet targets, nice people. As for the thanking of shoot staff, would always make an effort to do so when collecting card, and when leaving clubhouse to the ground owner, irrespective of their sometimes grumpy manner.
ips
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Ha ha, that made me laugh, that ex ground owner can indeed be a grump but also happens to be a very good friend that I have known and shot with for 20 yrs ish.
You are of course correct I too miss the A6 formerly Westhoughton GC a ground 20mins away for me that I have or rather did shoot since 86. Anyway back to the topic..................This ground closure issue is not just a ESP problem its across the board for various reasons planning be one and of course the financial climate. I remember in the 80s and 90s you could hardly get on some ground car parks they were that well attended and thurs eve at Westhoughton you had to book on by 6-30 or you would be shooting at 9pm. Look at the poor entrys to trap majors com pared to a few years back. I think the main problem is fuel costs we never thought twice about driving to grounds but now it can cost more to get there than to do the shoot. Many grounds MUST be running at a loss, whats the answer ? I dont know but if things continue we are all going to be in deep doo doo's.
Will Hewland
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Maybe the trend is that a bigger better job is the only way? Peoples expectations rise in all things.
Clay Shooting Company. The new Starbucks. :spiteful: :biggrin:
Clay Shooting Company. The new Starbucks. :spiteful: :biggrin:
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Money is I think the main reason that people are not shooting registered (and not necessarily people being prissy with grounds they like or do not like).
Cost of a shooting weekend has risen exponentially and add to that the fuel (which in mine is something like £30 to £60 extra if I travel) means that lots of people are staying local and / or just shooting practice.
Times are hard out there ....!
(Psst before everyone comes on stating they always thank refs.........don't make me name and shame :smile: ......I have shot with people on here who only remembered their manners when I said loudly on each stand 'thanks for your time ref'........they had already left the stand........point being......it does not matter on here if you say it.......it matters out there that you say it....!!
It is also helpful when you see a ref being bullied by a shooter who might be after the extra point...that you come out of the shadows and speak up...because that is the only way that we all together can make an impact on cheating. I never think twice about tipping in and saying 'right you have had your time, now you are having my time so get out the stand' (or words similar to that in my own inimitable style).....and I am only a girly. I am sure that all you on here...including the opinionated ones could also do it. Every little helps.)
Cost of a shooting weekend has risen exponentially and add to that the fuel (which in mine is something like £30 to £60 extra if I travel) means that lots of people are staying local and / or just shooting practice.
Times are hard out there ....!
(Psst before everyone comes on stating they always thank refs.........don't make me name and shame :smile: ......I have shot with people on here who only remembered their manners when I said loudly on each stand 'thanks for your time ref'........they had already left the stand........point being......it does not matter on here if you say it.......it matters out there that you say it....!!
It is also helpful when you see a ref being bullied by a shooter who might be after the extra point...that you come out of the shadows and speak up...because that is the only way that we all together can make an impact on cheating. I never think twice about tipping in and saying 'right you have had your time, now you are having my time so get out the stand' (or words similar to that in my own inimitable style).....and I am only a girly. I am sure that all you on here...including the opinionated ones could also do it. Every little helps.)
Will Hewland
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Yes, cost is an issue. However the first thing that will happen when money is tight is that people will shoot fewer times. Hence they become more discerning about where their hard-earned goes. £42 to shoot an unrewarding affair with unpopular squadding, or £37 to shoot Weston Wood on your own terms. Never heard market forces being referred to as `prissy` before..
Yes Ian, The 80's and 90's were good for clay shooting, fuel was much cheaper, as were most things. I used to travel for bloody miles to shoot at times and as you say, the grounds were often full and booking was essential. Then of course we have had all the bad press regarding anything to do with guns, which may also have prevented new blood from coming into the shooting sports, since the likes of Dunblane and Hungerford. All we can do is carry on as best we can I guess!Ha ha, that made me laugh, that ex ground owner can indeed be a grump but also happens to be a very good friend that I have known and shot with for 20 yrs ish.
This ground closure issue is not just a ESP problem its across the board for various reasons planning be one and of course the financial climate. I remember in the 80s and 90s you could hardly get on some ground car parks they were that well attended and thurs eve at Westhoughton you had to book on by 6-30 or you would be shooting at 9pm. Look at the poor entrys to trap majors com pared to a few years back. I think the main problem is fuel costs we never thought twice about driving to grounds but now it can cost more to get there than to do the shoot. Many grounds MUST be running at a loss, whats the answer ? I dont know but if things continue we are all going to be in deep doo doo's.
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Defo not.......or do you want every learner to have the experience that Matt mentioned which at big grounds with big expectations would most certainly happen.....because the 'types' who speak to new shooters in that way would feel even more able to if being held up at a bigger set up.
Nope......manners all around is what is needed.....and realistic expectations...!!
We need all grounds and the more the merrier.....and we need different grounds for different people's needs. Stiff competition grounds are tough for newbies. Easy grounds which are great for new shooters to get confidence are pooh poohed by the primas.
(Obviously this does not refer to Trap.......................joke.......before the whiners start......yes we do have hard and easy grounds in trap tooooooo.......and loves and hates.......but unlike sporters.....we still use them).
It is about time that shooters who normally whine 'I only want to shoot, I do not do politics'....realised that without someone 'doing' politics you will all be in the sh*t..! And you will not notice it until 'your' ground is closed down for whatever reason..!
But then that subject would bring in 'selfishness of shooters'......and life is too short.
So long and short......the simple answer is,.... Support your county set up.....engage with them to get more shooters into the sport.....enter the county championships and make them what they used to be....FULL and RESPECTED....and income to grounds. Be interested in what goes on 'in your name' as a member in 'your' Association (whichever it is) because what they do....decides your future.
And for those who say 'I am not in an association'....then I say 'join one you tight sods because they are supposed to protect our future'....
See simples....no members, no grounds, no sport......it is not rocket science.
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Is it impossible for you to stop bashing grounds like A1 just because they do not put targets on for the standard you might think you are. Several people including myself actually like the ground for the 5 disciplines that are available to shoot there. A massive amount of work has been done to that ground. GBR shooters train there in 4 of the disciplines.
We need all grounds.....if any of us are to survive.
At this very moment in this post you could be putting of a newbie from going and trying it.
Money is the main thing stopping people from travelling to shoots and making entries low....it is happening all over.....fact..!
A1 is a very good ground, Claudio has made so many improvements since he took over the place. I can remember when the ground was owned by Boss gunmakers, it only had a single ABT layout and that was it, it was run by Andrew Perkins for many years.
Will Hewland
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Nicola
I think if I sent you £1000 as an unencumbered gift you would find some problem with it. As you say, you are doing politics. Hear white from the other side, say black. Hear black, say white. Others have been vehement in their critiscism of A1, but nothing back from you.
No longer constructive.. I'm out..
I think if I sent you £1000 as an unencumbered gift you would find some problem with it. As you say, you are doing politics. Hear white from the other side, say black. Hear black, say white. Others have been vehement in their critiscism of A1, but nothing back from you.
No longer constructive.. I'm out..
Will I am biased as I only shoot trap, so for me A1 is great and so is Claudio, but I am not viewing it as a sporting shooter mate! :biggrin:
I think that maybe one of the problems we have with clayshooting growth is the greed factor.
Not many people want to be bothered in grass roots shooting, getting a group of friends together and shooting some form of discipline in a field midweek. Why? because it involves a little work and a little time and self sacrifice.
All of us oldies can remember the straw balers, 25 DTL or just a simple single manual trap and taking it in turn to trap whilst friends shot.
Not nowadays, into the car down to the ground 100 shots as quick as possible, back to the pub or home.
I know of a number of very good Sporting shooters who are well known for being miserable, arrogant, and if possible and they can get away with it downright cheats. Shock, horror, gasp.
I asked a very good Sporting shot the other day if he was coming shooting on Saturday " What £35 and no prize money, you've got to be joking".
Sadly I think that once we as sporting shooters have achieved the skill set to possibly win a competition, we get lulled into a mind set of we must win, it is our right to win.
In sporting if you don't get the score you want on a stand you bully and brow beat the child marking to give you the score you want. In skeet and trap you cannot do that.
Sadly Sporting is getting what it deserves, if you want quality you have to pay for it, if you want enthusiasm you have to give it, to get it back. It costs nothing to be polite and to say thank you, and there is a right and wrong way to make constructive criticism, but unless you give something you cannot expect to take anything away.
I know that I may have touched a few raw nerves in saying that cheating is rife, but sadly it is, and many of you know who the cheats are, but are you prepared to help to stop it?
Now please don't misunderstand me it isn't every competition, it is not the majority, it is the few spoiling it for the rest of us.
The only way we can go forward is to enjoy our sport and give something to make it better whether that is money, time or effort.
Not many people want to be bothered in grass roots shooting, getting a group of friends together and shooting some form of discipline in a field midweek. Why? because it involves a little work and a little time and self sacrifice.
All of us oldies can remember the straw balers, 25 DTL or just a simple single manual trap and taking it in turn to trap whilst friends shot.
Not nowadays, into the car down to the ground 100 shots as quick as possible, back to the pub or home.
I know of a number of very good Sporting shooters who are well known for being miserable, arrogant, and if possible and they can get away with it downright cheats. Shock, horror, gasp.
I asked a very good Sporting shot the other day if he was coming shooting on Saturday " What £35 and no prize money, you've got to be joking".
Sadly I think that once we as sporting shooters have achieved the skill set to possibly win a competition, we get lulled into a mind set of we must win, it is our right to win.
In sporting if you don't get the score you want on a stand you bully and brow beat the child marking to give you the score you want. In skeet and trap you cannot do that.
Sadly Sporting is getting what it deserves, if you want quality you have to pay for it, if you want enthusiasm you have to give it, to get it back. It costs nothing to be polite and to say thank you, and there is a right and wrong way to make constructive criticism, but unless you give something you cannot expect to take anything away.
I know that I may have touched a few raw nerves in saying that cheating is rife, but sadly it is, and many of you know who the cheats are, but are you prepared to help to stop it?
Now please don't misunderstand me it isn't every competition, it is not the majority, it is the few spoiling it for the rest of us.
The only way we can go forward is to enjoy our sport and give something to make it better whether that is money, time or effort.
Will Hewland
Well-known member
Quite!Read my posts, their ground is increasingly trap based. They do it well, I wish them well. ESP just isn't their thing, as they have found out, so they pulled it. I hope they have a great future!
Lets be extra special f'ing clear here. The GROUND is great. One of their many products was not, for competition purposes at least, as demonstrated by the lack of customers for it. End of..
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Outlaw
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I have told you before Will ....I do not want your gifts :smile: I am a happily married woman :smile: (For those with no sense of humour this is a joke)
As for the A1 comments I generally stay out of the conversations for the obvious reasons and the comments move on.....but on this you have been relentless (in a nice way) and I do not think you are aware of the negative impression you give that might put people off. It s a great ground....but obviously you do not think it is for you....and that is fine.....but other people like it....so give it a chance to exist how it wants to exist.
I am not doing politics I am trying to stop you from rubbishing a ground that others on here actually like.
I am sure you can understand that without stropping.
Again I say....we need grounds.....all types of grounds.....for our sports survival.
As long as Claudio has been the owner it has been a fantastic trap ground.
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