Sporting shoots. Where - and how did it go?

[FreeShot]

Nine times out of ten the winners are those who hit all the easy ones. 

Spot on.

 

[Richard59]

Can never be too tough, if you can't hit the targets then try giving them the correct lead... or take some lessons and learn.., you don't improve by shooting easy targets

Oh but Jonz one did hit all presentations just didn't hit anywhere near enough of them ?, don't quite agree with your general statement a shoot needs a bit of balance, most who shot it were clearly outspoken on the day, unless of course you heard different? 

 

[Will Hewland]

Oh but Jonz one did hit all presentations just didn't hit anywhere near enough of them ?, don't quite agree with your general statement a shoot needs a bit of balance, most who shot it were clearly outspoken on the day, unless of course you heard different? 

I think we had similar conversation a few years ago with Jonz, who if I recall doesn't shoot registered shoots? Tough local shoots aren't quite like a tough registered event usually. And yes, of course it needs balance. Any fool can make it too hard. 

 

[Bebo]

Stand 12 was an odd thing anyway and it was easily missed if taken at the wrong time - it was quite a distance as well.  Was stand 10 (if walking up the hill) to the right in the corner of the last section of the shoot?  If it was I managed to hit that first bird but in honest it was always a bit of "ooh I hope I get this".

Yes, first stand as you enter the woods at the top. Big left to right, very edge on coming out from behind the tree and starting to drop quite quickly. Hold point too high on the first one got the line wrong. Hit the next two and then was a bit erratic on the last one, was slower moving the gun and then pushed through to much trying to compensate.

 

[jonz]

I'm a firm believer of you should always learn from each shoot, registered or not, it makes no difference, as long as the targets are within range it's fair. Yes a 15 yard target can be as hard to smash as a 50 yard target, you have to be able to read the target and put your shot in the right place. If you can't do that then learn how to, either by practice or get some good coaching. Only going to shoots that are easy won't teach you anything and I'll stick by my first comment "It can never to too tough" 

Yes grounds have to keep shooters happy to make them come back but there are a lot of registered shoots where B &C class are won on 80 + scores so something is wrong somewhere 

What are these B & C class shooters learning? Not a lot on how to hit testing targets . 

Ive been shooting long enough to remember when high gun was always in the 80's and a score of over 90 was a one off from the top shooters on a very good day, now it's the norm for most of AA class to be above 90, until they come down to earth with a bump and find someone who has set a different set of targets and the can't read or hit , and then it's too tough a shoot. Sorry but that doesn't fit with the way I see things

 

[Will Hewland]

The shooting standard is so high at the top these days, partly I suspect because there ARE lots of firm registered shoots at which these guys gain their experience and skills. The stars like Martin Myers, RF and a 100 others are going to put in a 95+ at shoots that might make your eyes water. If you try and make these guys end on 88, you will have a large crowd of lower end folk down in the 40's and actually learning not a lot because repeatedly not hitting a target doesn't teach you anything. The brain logs what a hit looks like, so you need to do it occasionally.

Nothing is more misguided than to expect C and B class to be won on low scores. Rising stars will always bang in the odd high score. They are merely AA shooters in waiting, who haven't been swept up by the present CPSA system which takes too long to move them up. Also, some shooters remain in the lower classes because they are inconsistent and shoot with emotion rather than method. This means they can put in a big score, but their average is poor. Another reason for not judging lower class winning scores. 

 

[Sian]

The shooting standard is so high at the top these days, partly I suspect because there ARE lots of firm registered shoots at which these guys gain their experience and skills. The stars like Martin Myers, RF and a 100 others are going to put in a 95+ at shoots that might make your eyes water. If you try and make these guys end on 88, you will have a large crowd of lower end folk down in the 40's and actually learning not a lot because repeatedly not hitting a target doesn't teach you anything. The brain logs what a hit looks like, so you need to do it occasionally.

Nothing is more misguided than to expect C and B class to be won on low scores. Rising stars will always bang in the odd high score. They are merely AA shooters who haven't been swept up by the present CPSA system which takes too long to move them up. Also, some shooters remain on the lower classes because they are inconsistent and shoot with emotion rather than method. This means they can put in a big score, but their average is poor. Another reason for not judging lower class winning scores. 

God that second paragraph could be me William

 

[Will Hewland]

God that second paragraph could be me William

It's my mate Steve too.. he's had HG and a white stick on different days. 

 

[Hamster]

I'm a firm believer of you should always learn from each shoot, registered or not, it makes no difference, as long as the targets are within range it's fair. Yes a 15 yard target can be as hard to smash as a 50 yard target, you have to be able to read the target and put your shot in the right place. If you can't do that then learn how to, either by practice or get some good coaching. Only going to shoots that are easy won't teach you anything and I'll stick by my first comment "It can never to too tough" 

Yes grounds have to keep shooters happy to make them come back but there are a lot of registered shoots where B &C class are won on 80 + scores so something is wrong somewhere 

What are these B & C class shooters learning? Not a lot on how to hit testing targets . 

Ive been shooting long enough to remember when high gun was always in the 80's and a score of over 90 was a one off from the top shooters on a very good day, now it's the norm for most of AA class to be above 90, until they come down to earth with a bump and find someone who has set a different set of targets and the can't read or hit , and then it's too tough a shoot. Sorry but that doesn't fit with the way I see things

I've shot long enough too to remember 100 birders being almost unheard of, you had to scour the local papers to find a tiny box ad for a charity 50 birder or make do with the fortnightly club meet where everyone got there at 7 am to help set up  . You are quite correct that back then you woz in the money with a 44+ on dustbin lid type targets that todays A class shots would miss through boredom. 

In the past 20 odd years though the difficulty level of shoots has moved up a notch or three and with it the standards, I once went back on scores on the CPSA averages and found the cut off for AAA and AA hadn't changed more than about a single digit. 

 

[Westward]

I'm a firm believer of you should always learn from each shoot, registered or not, it makes no difference, as long as the targets are within range it's fair. Yes a 15 yard target can be as hard to smash as a 50 yard target, you have to be able to read the target and put your shot in the right place. If you can't do that then learn how to, either by practice or get some good coaching. Only going to shoots that are easy won't teach you anything and I'll stick by my first comment "It can never to too tough" 

Yes grounds have to keep shooters happy to make them come back but there are a lot of registered shoots where B &C class are won on 80 + scores so something is wrong somewhere 

What are these B & C class shooters learning? Not a lot on how to hit testing targets . 

Ive been shooting long enough to remember when high gun was always in the 80's and a score of over 90 was a one off from the top shooters on a very good day, now it's the norm for most of AA class to be above 90, until they come down to earth with a bump and find someone who has set a different set of targets and the can't read or hit , and then it's too tough a shoot. Sorry but that doesn't fit with the way I see things

I think that's an over-simplification. The reality is that shoot organisers and ground owners have to make money and if they lose perhaps 50% of their customers because they aren't willing to be repeatedly hammered by overly hard targets, then pretty soon there won't be any registered shoots at all. As Will says, getting beaten up by the course setter doesn't automatically mean shooters will get better. No one's against a reasonable challenge but disillusionment leads to people drifting away back to where they feel comfortable at practice grounds and straw balers.

I was reffing at Longridge yesterday and some people really suffered including an AA who posted a 58, but setting up registered shoots can be very tricky. A few weeks ago at Longridge, Steve thought it would be won with a 91 or 92 and in the event there was a 98 and two 97s.

It's just not that easy or simple to get the balance right and I believe that setting up the shoot to challenge the top 10% and thereby burying the C & B class shots would mean the end of registered sporting quite quickly.

 

[Rupert]

Superstars dont pay the bills, its the classes, keep them happy,not quite ecstatic and they will keep filling the entry sheets that make all the sundays happen. Target difficulty is relative to the ability of the individual about to call Pull.

 

[Hamster]

i'm not even convinced the top 10% want to get beaten up by overly hard targets. There comes a point you cease to be entertaining or even testing people but merely having a laugh at their expense. 

 

[Westward]

Superstars dont pay the bills, its the classes, keep them happy,not quite ecstatic and they will keep filling the entry sheets that make all the sundays happen. Target difficulty is relative to the ability of the individual about to call Pull.

Absolutely. The duffers like me pay the same entry fee as the top shots - and there are more of us... :baby:

 

[wylye]

Its the easiest thing in the world to set a hard course. All you do is place traps without any thought or planning and have no regard for the degree of difficulty, terrain, position of the sun, wind direction etc etc. Oh and make sure that the floor of the stand is uneven or covered in empty cases or both and that the scorer has no knowledge of any rules. That should do it.

 

[Sian]

It's my mate Steve too.. he's had HG and a white stick on different days. 

I know Steve and I have a lot in common ?

 

[Richard59]

As per my posting after being well and truly "found out" at Longridge I bravely took on Coleys today, squadded event I was shooting at 2.30, last rotation and the scores on display were a bit lower than I'd expect from the names  already shot, ex Gloucester and England prop forward Phil Blakeway was leading on 93, looked to be the only 90+ from first two rotations and these were I'm told "full" our merry squad was just five today, and a fabulous famous five we were in shooting order, I think it went, Glamour Girl Zea, this old duffer, Silver Spoon Joe Hale, Puppy Paw Stew Keen and the dispicable me dead ringer Steve Lovatt, one had a roller coaster shoot I couldn't find a large (high) midi off the tower nor a longish rabbit that we shot down off the bunding, then for our last stand, and I'm up first, they put on a simo pair of double trap targets, marmite stand, real marmite not the pretend stuff but real marmite, won't be surprised to read I dropped 6/10 so ??? from me to end on 72, at 2.30 I'd been happy with a 7 in front, dropping 13 / 26 on last three stands somewhat took the wind from my sails, anyway Zea 62, Joe 82, Stew 86 and Steve Lovatt 96 to take high gun, early in shoot during a stoppage I did have a dry mount with Steves K80, even more impressed that he put in a 96 with a gun that this lightweight old codger found really heavy. 

Cracking day, superb weather, top squad of chums, I really enjoyed 11/12 stands so overall well done Coleys?

 

[Doug Pinnegar]

Just looked at the scores and you're right, anything with a 7 in front looks good in C. 

Gutted to miss it, been hard at work staying hydrated in this heat over here ?? 

 

[Worcs]

As per my posting after being well and truly "found out" at Longridge I bravely took on Coleys today, squadded event I was shooting at 2.30, last rotation and the scores on display were a bit lower than I'd expect from the names  already shot, ex Gloucester and England prop forward Phil Blakeway was leading on 93, looked to be the only 90+ from first two rotations and these were I'm told "full" our merry squad was just five today, and a fabulous famous five we were in shooting order, I think it went, Glamour Girl Zea, this old duffer, Silver Spoon Joe Hale, Puppy Paw Stew Keen and the dispicable me dead ringer Steve Lovatt, one had a roller coaster shoot I couldn't find a large (high) midi off the tower nor a longish rabbit that we shot down off the bunding, then for our last stand, and I'm up first, they put on a simo pair of double trap targets, marmite stand, real marmite not the pretend stuff but real marmite, won't be surprised to read I dropped 6/10 so ??? from me to end on 72, at 2.30 I'd been happy with a 7 in front, dropping 13 / 26 on last three stands somewhat took the wind from my sails, anyway Zea 62, Joe 82, Stew 86 and Steve Lovatt 96 to take high gun, early in shoot during a stoppage I did have a dry mount with Steves K80, even more impressed that he put in a 96 with a gun that this lightweight old codger found really heavy. 

Cracking day, superb weather, top squad of chums, I really enjoyed 11/12 stands so overall well done Coleys?

I wish they'd do comp's at the weekend.

 

[Bebo]

Shot EJ Churchill's Registered shoot earlier.  It was hot.

 

[P1Fanatic]

Shot EJ Churchill's Registered shoot earlier.  It was hot.

Yep. Car was showing 34c driving up the A404M. Was very humid. I used both your and Will's tips and had a cooler with one frozen water bottle. Drank a whole litre going around.

Only problem stands were 5 the grouse butt. Hit first pair fine shooting straight at them and then decided to add some lead. Stand 6 dropped 4 only hitting one of the yellow r-l. Straighted the last 6 stands to finish on 88 which beats my previous registered PB by 1 so happy with that but always rue the silly ones that got away.

Did notice a few questioning that midi dropper on 2 saying not coming out of the trees but I saw it fine stood behind. Ref was poorly placed several metres off to the left. Same on 9 when rabbit came down the bank calling it a no bird.