target angle

[Dog Tyred]

Which is the question I raised back in post 17 but no one has yet answered.

On peg 1 should you actually set your stance more towards the centre of the possible target angle (left of the trap house) but mount your gun at the target crossover point i.e right of where you stance is actually pointing in the same way that a sporting shooter would set his/her stance to where he/she expects to shoot the target but with the gun hold at the point where they expect to pick up the target? Not quite the same for trap as the target can go either direction so if you do get a RH target you are already part way through your possible gun movement to the right when you see the target. Hope that's clear :ermm:

DT

When I said 'Hope that's clear' I meant I hope the question is clear. Now what's the answer?

DT

Edit: Sorry John posted at the same time.

 

[ips]

Which is the question I raised back in post 17 but no one has yet answered.

On peg 1 should you actually set your stance more towards the centre of the possible target angle (left of the trap house) but mount your gun at the target crossover point i.e right of where you stance is actually pointing in the same way that a sporting shooter would set his/her stance to where he/she expects to shoot the target but with the gun hold at the point where they expect to pick up the target? Not quite the same for trap as the target can go either direction so if you do get a RH target you are already part way through your possible gun movement to the right when you see the target. Hope that's clear :ermm:

DT

Edit, hang on I think I have read this wrong.

Ok read it again not sure I fully understand the question, but.

All I can say is that on ABT I get to the mat and forget about were the trap is or my hold point I look out and work out were I am likely to have to hit the most extreme "kumquat" then I have a shuffle about until I am set up comfortably for that "kumquat" which is inevitably the "kumquat" that I will get. So the answer to your question is I don't know but thats what I do.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[SIMON-B]

Isn't half the fun of ABT not knowing what angle the clay will be presented. As a simple hedge monkey all these angles are hurting my brain, I'm going to put my wellies on and polish my auto to relax now..

Thats when the fight started

 

[ips]

Yes it is simon and part of the skill is to set up to favour the worse scenario target unlike OT which is really just old mans ABT as its all from peg 3 oops did I just write that, oh sod it "ENTER"

 

[SIMON-B]

Ian I have only shot ABT twice and both times I found I was shooting over the top of the wide angle birds, just couldn't seem to dig them out. I suppose this is where you dedicated trappies look for advantages regard foot position and hold points. I can see the how it becomes frustrating and rewarding at the same time.

Thats when the fight started

 

[ips]

Simon

ABT is a very hard game but highly addictive and at the same time frustrating, personally I think its all about worse case scenario and compromise, you compromise gun hold, focus point etc etc the skill imo is getting the compromise at its optimum.

 

[Dog Tyred]

OK final answer.

Standing on peg 1 with your gun hold 2 metres out from the leading edge of the trap house (corresponding to the LH edge of the TH) the angle of view relative to the peg 3 position (0 degrees) is 19.44 degrees. Add this to the theoretical maximum throw angle of the target of 32.5 degrees equates to a target angle from peg 1 of 51.94 degrees.

Obviously the further out your gun hold from the trap house the angle decreases.

Thats it, I'm out!

DT

 

[Paul120]

I'm pretty sure that you can't just add the angles like that. The actual angle you swing the gun through is going to depend on how far out the clay is from the trap house before you hit it.

The easiest way to explain why the angle would change with distance is to use peg 3 as an example. If a clay comes out of the trap house at 32.5deg to the right and you hit it 10m out (unlikely but we can all dream) you can imagine a right angle with the hypotenuse of the triangle being the 10m between the trap and the clay. Sine 32.5 * 10 gives you the offset to the right from the centreline of the trap house to the clay (5.37m), whilst cosine 3.25*10 gives you the distance the clay is out from the trap house if measured perpendicular to the front face of the trap. (8.43m). If you are standing 15m directly behind the trap, then the right angled triangle between you and the clay would have an 'opposite' side of 5.37m (as it is the same offset as from the trap) and an 'adjacent' side of 15m + 8.43m = 23.43m. Inverse Tan 5.37/23.43 would mean the gun would need to point at an angle of 12.9 deg to the right to hit the clay.

If we then look at the situation with the clay 20m out, the 'opposite' increases to 10.74m and the 'adjacent' increases to 31.86m. Inverse Tan 10.74/31.86 gives an angle of 18.63 degrees. Ergo the further out the clay gets the bigger the angle you need to swing the gun through.

If someone wants to give me a typical estimate of how far the clay is out of the trap when its hit I can use the above method (plus the sine and cosine rules) to work out the max angles to the left and right from pegs 1 and 2 (you'd then just need to reverse them for pegs 4 and 5).

PS. I'm better at trigonometry than shooting.

 

[ips]

Very enlightening Paul

 

[jwpzx9r]

OK final answer.

Standing on peg 1 with your gun hold 2 metres out from the leading edge of the trap house (corresponding to the LH edge of the TH) the angle of view relative to the pag position (0 degrees) is 19.44 degrees. Add this to the theoretical maximum throw angle of the target of 32.5 degrees equates to a target angle from peg 1 of 51.94 degrees.

Obviously the further out your gun hold from the trap house the angle decreases.

Thats it, I'm out!

DT

Ah.... but what if you do it standing with your gun over your shoulder while facing the opposite direction using a mirror to sight the gun all the time mumbling the twelve times table... BACKWARDS !

 

[Dog Tyred]

I've already said 'I'm ooot"

DT

 

[Les53]

Very enlightening Paul

Yes it is so! However.........if I were to even contemplate such things within five miles of the line I would be totally buggered up and would probably miss every bird!!! 

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Yes it is so! However.........if I were to even contemplate such things within five miles of the line I would be totally buggered up and would probably miss every bird!!! 

+1

L  O  L  

 

[Wonko the Sane]

You had better draw infinite examples then because you have to accommodate the vary many choices of shooters foot positions on each peg. (And how the foot position changes the angle of the body relative to where you are looking for the exit of the clay ...and different relative to the angle set for the clay) and how those positions change on a windy day when some shooters set up deliberately different in order to accommodate for the wind)).

Good luck...that should take you the rest of the week :wink:

You left out the part about how quickly the target is shot.  As Nicola points out, there are a mass of variables that contribute to "target angle", and the station/projection angle is only one of them.   

The real point being that the "target angle" and the "gun angle" are not even the same thing and should prolly not even be in the same discussion.

But then, MirrorWorld again.  WTF do I know?   :haha:

Here's a puzzler - if you're on Station2 of a skeet field the projection angle of the low house target relative to you is prolly something like 160-170deg relative to you.  How can you possibly shoot a target with that much angle.  OMG!!  At Station1 it is almost 180deg!!!  Makes those pussy 45deg trap angles something for children to practice on, eh?

 

[Paul120]

Very enlightening Paul

Where did my comment go? Flaming android...

Forgot what I had said now..

 

[Paul120]

Ah.. Remember now... It was about?. do I start to work on the maths before or after I call pull?

 

[Wonko the Sane]

Ah.. Remember now... It was about?. do I start to work on the maths before or after I call pull?

Well, if the process is to be successful you prolly ought to be doing the calc's non-stop from the time you hit the field.

 

[Les53]

Well, if the process is to be successful you prolly ought to be doing the calc's non-stop from the time you.. hit the field.

Blimey Charlie! It would be suicide mate! Best thing is to leave the conscious brain at home! Even though my wife says I don't have one!! .....And.....she is always right!!!

 

[Wonko the Sane]

maybr not always right, but never wrong

 

[Les53]

maybr not always right, but never wrong

Yes Charlie....that as well