Newbie from London

[Kimberley]

Hey all, Kimberley from West London.  Just joined a few days ago, hope you’re all well! 
 
I’ve looked and read through a number of your threads already (some interesting stuff here!) I’m a complete newbie, only tried clay shooting for the first time in November - then everywhere shut again - I’ve had half a dozen lessons, been with family and the other half a couple times but using different guns each time isn’t working very well and isn’t appealing.

I’ve tried a few different guns from 28 gauge to 12 gauge. The 28 I tried was way too light, the 20 was ok but I felt most comfortable with the 12. Perhaps it comes down to weight rather than gauge? 

So I’m petite at 5ft 2” with a fairly small build. 

I’ve tried a Kofs 38g, Yildiz 20g, 686 silver pigeon 1, a Beretta ultralight, a 690 field 3. The only ones I have liked so far really have been the 686 and the 690.

I have also only used full length stick which feels too long, yet when my face is down properly, it comes forward a lot (I used to be called giraffe at school…) I am now looking at the Vittoria stock so I am slightly higher though I would still need adjustable.

After all my spiel… my question is does anyone have opinions on a 686 vs 690 and difference in 28” or 30” barrels as I have tried both and don’t feel one is better than the other.

I have most definitely “got the bug” and would like to purchase a gun that I like and can then have fitted to me. Also, I probably don’t want anything over the 7lb 7/8 mark.

If you’ve read all this thank you! any advice would be so very welcome! 
 

Thanks, 

K

 

[Will Hewland]

Lovely to hear that you are so keen and have thought about it all so carefully.

OK, definitely 12g gun. Absolutely nobody serious uses anything else. Cartridges are cheaper too.  Beretta is a great brand and either of the ones mentioned are good. Go with the best fit. I would go straight to 30” because if you get serious it will be that or 32” eventually. Don’t go for any expensive gun fitting too soon, because it relies upon you having a well developed stance and hold which will take time to develop. An approximate fit for now is fine. 

 

[donna]

Welcome to the forum, there are a few of us ladies on here and most have experienced what you’re going through now so don’t panic!  
Im only 4’11” and not too heavily built and I would say all us ladies here would tell you to go for a 12 guage.  Once it’s fitted to you it won’t feel heavy and should be balanced nicely.  Gun fit is everything, if your gun isnt fitted to you it won’t matter which one you pick up it, will feel wrong.  Also most ladies have longer necks so I would advise you to go for a gun with an adjustable stock and get someone decent to fit it for you.  My gun is a 12 guage, 32” barrels and weighs 8lb 2 oz but I had it fitted by Ben Husthwaite and it fits like a glove, doesn’t feel heavy at all, no recoil and since it’s been done properly my scores have improved week on week.  
So my advice would be once youve chosen your gun, get it fitted then practice and practice and most of all enjoy yourself. 

 

[Will Hewland]

Welcome to the forum, there are a few of us ladies on here and most have experienced what you’re going through now so don’t panic!  
Im only 4’11” and not too heavily built and I would say all us ladies here would tell you to go for a 12 guage.  Once it’s fitted to you it won’t feel heavy and should be balanced nicely.  Gun fit is everything, if your gun isnt fitted to you it won’t matter which one you pick up it, will feel wrong.  Also most ladies have longer necks so I would advise you to go for a gun with an adjustable stock and get someone decent to fit it for you.  My gun is a 12 guage, 32” barrels and weighs 8lb 2 oz but I had it fitted by Ben Husthwaite and it fits like a glove, doesn’t feel heavy at all, no recoil and since it’s been done properly my scores have improved week on week.  
So my advice would be once youve chosen your gun, get it fitted then practice and practice and most of all enjoy yourself. 

You’re right Donna. Just noting that you’ve been shooting for ages, so gun fit can be done and stay correct. With a newer shooter, there’s no stable platform as yet. X

 

[donna]

You’re right Donna. Just noting that you’ve been shooting for ages, so gun fit can be done and stay correct. With a newer shooter, there’s no stable platform as yet. X

Totally agree Will, I had my old MK38 fitted by a local chap, when I got my new gun last year, I had it set up the same but it wasn’t right!  The stock length was right but it wasn’t balanced, Ben took one look at it, altered a few things and I’ve never looked back.  

 

[Bebo]

I'll just re-iterate the above, 12g 30" barrels and either of the Berettas you mention will do the job for you.  I'm 5'4"ish and don't have a particularly long neck, but I do like to see a lot of rib when I shoot.  I bought a Beretta with a Vitoria stock last year - length and pitch at the back were spot on.  Height of comb was about right, but the cast was off slightly so I got an adjustable comb fitted.  It's now set up so what I see when a target breaks is exactly the same as my other gun.  Definitely look at the Vitoria stock and see if you can test it at a ground.  If you can get away without reducing the length or changing the pitch, getting an adjustable comb put in will be a much cheaper option to getting the fit you want that getting a standard stock altered.

Depending on your budget the other one I'd recommend having a look at it is the Blaser F16 Sporting Intuition.  I shouldered one a while ago at Churchill's gunroom and if felt really good.  If I didn't love my Kreighoff I think I'd seriously consider one.

 

[Luke_(NL)]

In terms of technical differences, there isn’t much that separates a 690 from a 686. If the technical aspect interests you, TGS did a video comparison of the 686 vs 69X internals, which is easy to find on YouTube. I think the 690 is available with an adjustable comb as standard, not sure about the 686’s but there are so many variations that I’m sure it can be bought or made. The second hand market for both is definitely worth a look too. Money saved on your gun can be towards tuition and cartridges which will serve you better than the “ooh shiny” factor.  

I definitely recommend an adjustable comb when starting out: As Will and others have pointed out, fit matters a lot, but your stance and posture will ‘develop’ over time. An adjustable comb lets you sort small changes easily (and more importantly, undo changes that don’t work out).  

I own and shoot both a 692 and a 686 and they do handle differently because of where the weight is. In terms of barrel length I’ll go against the majority here and say that a 28 or 30” can be made into a 30 or 32” with extended chokes (which come in anything up to +2” versions) but the other way round requires a hack-saw. I like shorter barrels for ease of handling and speed, but then I shoot more skeet than sporting.   

Most importantly, enjoy yourself! 

 

[Fred Flintstone]

Hi Kimberley... and welcome!

I have a 686E which I got second hand and absolutely love. 
It doesn’t have an adjustable comb, but then it was a very good fit ‘off the shelf’, and I’m not even thinking about getting fitted further for another year or so, once I have built consistency.
I’d echo Luke’s comment above and absolutely say have a good look around the second hand market. Berettas do hold their value, but there are some good deals to be had on guns that are as good as new.

 

[Kimberley]

Hi all, 

Thanks to you all for your responses, they are very handy and insightful. I had another lesson today and used a 30” 691 vittoria (it was right handed they don’t seem to keep many left). I loved the gun and I liked the stock. The length of the stock felt more comfortable but even with the Monte Carlo it is still too low so I’d need adjustable regardless. After using for nearly 90 minutes my arm was getting shaky and I was concentrating on that as much as trying to hit anything  and the weight was just a little too much so after speaking with the instructor who agreed the gun seems a good fit but if I’m a bit uncomfortable that won’t be so much fun he suggested going for the 28” as that would probably be the right weight for me with those couple oz less. 
 

I am going to look around for a left hand 691/693 field vittoria with 28” barrels (thank you to all those that said go with the 30 but I think it’s a bit much for me right now!) Ideally second hand but I have found zero so far so may only be able to go new!

Thanks again

Kimberley 
 

 

[Will Hewland]

Hi all, 

Thanks to you all for your responses, they are very handy and insightful. I had another lesson today and used a 30” 691 vittoria (it was right handed they don’t seem to keep many left). I loved the gun and I liked the stock. The length of the stock felt more comfortable but even with the Monte Carlo it is still too low so I’d need adjustable regardless. After using for nearly 90 minutes my arm was getting shaky and I was concentrating on that as much as trying to hit anything  and the weight was just a little too much so after speaking with the instructor who agreed the gun seems a good fit but if I’m a bit uncomfortable that won’t be so much fun he suggested going for the 28” as that would probably be the right weight for me with those couple oz less. 
 

I am going to look around for a left hand 691/693 field vittoria with 28” barrels (thank you to all those that said go with the 30 but I think it’s a bit much for me right now!) Ideally second hand but I have found zero so far so may only be able to go new!

Thanks again

Kimberley 
 

It’s a classic issue for a beginner to want a light gun, for two reasons. Firstly holding a gun is a new thing so muscles aren’t used to it, but will be later on. Secondly a beginner holds the gun up for way longer than an experienced shooter because they spend time ensuring the mount etc is right. Trust me, an experienced 12 year old girl will handle an 8lb gun with ease.. don’t buy an excessively lightweight gun as you will lose some stability in use. 

 

[JoostB]

Do they sell the Vittoria's off the shelf with adjustable combs?

 

[Fred Flintstone]

Do they sell the Vittoria's off the shelf with adjustable combs?

There are a few showing on guntrader (new)

 

[JoostB]

Thnx, found them. They all seem to be 694's. Wonder if it is possible to get a 693 also with the adj comb.

 

[Bebo]

Hi all, 

Thanks to you all for your responses, they are very handy and insightful. I had another lesson today and used a 30” 691 vittoria (it was right handed they don’t seem to keep many left). I loved the gun and I liked the stock. The length of the stock felt more comfortable but even with the Monte Carlo it is still too low so I’d need adjustable regardless. After using for nearly 90 minutes my arm was getting shaky and I was concentrating on that as much as trying to hit anything  and the weight was just a little too much so after speaking with the instructor who agreed the gun seems a good fit but if I’m a bit uncomfortable that won’t be so much fun he suggested going for the 28” as that would probably be the right weight for me with those couple oz less. 
 

I am going to look around for a left hand 691/693 field vittoria with 28” barrels (thank you to all those that said go with the 30 but I think it’s a bit much for me right now!) Ideally second hand but I have found zero so far so may only be able to go new!

Thanks again

Kimberley 
 

If you have to have an adjustable comb and you can only find the 691/693 new, you might actually find it cheaper going for a second hand 686, getting it shortened and an adjustable comb fitted.  Adjustable combs come in at around £250 (at least that was what I paid for one last year) and if it's just shortening LOP that shouldn't be too expensive.

 

[ehb102]

£250 for an adjustable comb? Where, at EJ Churchill's?

 

[JoostB]

If you have to have an adjustable comb and you can only find the 691/693 new, you might actually find it cheaper going for a second hand 686, getting it shortened and an adjustable comb fitted.  Adjustable combs come in at around £250 (at least that was what I paid for one last year) and if it's just shortening LOP that shouldn't be too expensive.

Thanks for the advice. It would be for my girlfriend. She really likes the smaller pistol grip. Shortening the stock would not make the grip any smaller. She tried a 693 vittoria and a b525 liberty light. She liked the vittoria, but found the Monte Carlo still on the low side. 

 

[Bebo]

£250 for an adjustable comb? Where, at EJ Churchill's?

Doveridge

Thanks for the advice. It would be for my girlfriend. She really likes the smaller pistol grip. Shortening the stock would not make the grip any smaller. She tried a 693 vittoria and a b525 liberty light. She liked the vittoria, but found the Monte Carlo still on the low side. 

I've got a Vitoria stock on my semi-auto.  Must admit I didn't fell a great deal of difference to my DT10. It's smaller than my K80 and less distance between grip and trigger, which is nicer if you have small hands and short fingers (I do).

 

[JoostB]

That is actually what I mean. The smaller distance between the grip and the trigger.  

 

[Bebo]

That is actually what I mean. The smaller distance between the grip and the trigger.  

My main gun has an adjustable trigger, so I just have that set back as far as possible and cope with it.  Hand position is on of the things that least matters in terms of gun fit and ability to hit targets.