The AGM

[sarachambers]

People with lots of time on their hands who don't go out much.

Actually I have far too little time on my hands and attended to looking into this after I finished work - usually around midnight, for your information. In 15 years of shooting, I have never been involved in CPSA politics before but I wasn't going to stand by and watch something pushed through in a way I considered would be in breach of the articles and would change the balance of powers of the organisation.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Exactly right Sara,

..... and peeps that is exactly the same type of effort put in to the association by all of us who work on county and regional committees..........our time is given .......AFTER WORK...!!

Wylye's flippant throw away comment that he obviously thinks is funny......is in fact an insult to anyone who turned out or voted.

I do not like people insulting the membership who are bothered about the association enough to do something about it.

Still back on point......I would like to know the demographic of the people who cast a vote.

 

[ehb102]

What was pathetic is that only about 800 out of 23,000 returned a vote.

Respectfully,I think your expectations should change. 800 of 23000 is nearly 3.5%. That's pretty good for an organisation where the majority of members have no direct involvement with the organisation. I forget whose metric it is, but in online community management we expect 1% of members to be contribute a lot, 5% of members to be contribute frequently, a further 20% to contribute occasionally and the rest to lurk. For real-world communities the numbers fall even more. As the CPSA has no community, no dialogue with most of its members, only push-communications (they "push" out the information) and it certainly doesn't have an ongoing conversation with most subscribers, I think you and Sarah should be congratulated for getting that many proxy votes at all. 800 votes is a stunning show of action from that size of membership given the current situation. 

 

[** Pending Removal **]

I think that 800 out of 23,000 is most certainly not the voice of the membership.....and I would hope by the time the next vote comes up, that we will have engaged more of the membership to get of their arses and take 5 minutes to cast a vote.

I have never been someone who has been impressed by the 'poor' return stats........I think it is lazy by any organisation to accept them without actively trying to engage with their membership.

Of course it suits many organisations to have a silent membership....who keep asleep .....and allow anything to be done.

Well we are an association which was set up by people who did bother, who did want to keep shooting when live pigeon was stopped in the UK.........I would hate to think that we are now in a worst apathetic state than the founders.....when we have the benefit of instant email communication.

Come on people.....this is not ducking rocket science.......this is a sport. Things should be done with the interest of the membership and in the 'spirit' of the sport....!!

I have never liked being put in a 'type' box......and therefore no matter how it is dressed...........'I' am not happy with 800/23,000 and 'I' know we can do better.......!!

.........just saying..!!

..........true story...!!

 

[ehb102]

..'I' am not happy with 800/23,000 and 'I' know we can do better.......!!

It would be perfectly possible to have more people take action, but not without a huge investment of resources of both time any money and not without a big culture change and possibly a structural change. Should you wish to work to bring this about then good for you. Personally I believe that not voting is just as valid a statement as voting. 

 

[** Pending Removal **]

It does not cost money to talk......we are doing it now.

:smile:

We have done it on topics where you want help or advice.......so communication here is easy.

The costs for a vote is the same for all members....because the vote has to go to all members for it to be safe and fair.

The costs are spent whether you vote or not .

The info is always talked about on all the forums

There is absolutely no reason why a member cannot have a voice one way or tother .........except for laziness. :smile:

 

[Chard]

This needs to be dragged back into perspective.

There's a very simple reason why the vast majority of the membership aren't interested. They're not convinced that any of this drama will make a blind bit of difference. In this situation, what you tend to get is one or two people who are "in the know" who are giving it large to the rest of the membership. Unfortunately they talk in riddles about people that nobody knows anything about. Insults get hurled in all directions and most people don't have sufficient knowledge of the individuals (or aren't sufficiently interested) to form an opinion on whether it's tripe or not. There are usually axes being ground somewhere in there. People are being "advised" to vote one way or another about a subject on which they have no knowledge.

There is usually a pitiful attempt at shaming, bullying and haranguing passive members into toeing the line, by calling them stupid or lazy if they don't immerse themselves arse-deep in the political ins and outs. History has shown that 9 times out of 10, all this radical change and reform doesn't make any appreciable difference at all.

As the song goes - "Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss" <_<

 

[** Pending Removal **]

This needs to be dragged back into perspective.

There's a very simple reason why the vast majority of the membership aren't interested. They're not convinced that any of this drama will make a blind bit of difference. In this situation, what you tend to get is one or two people who are "in the know" who are giving it large to the rest of the membership. Unfortunately they talk in riddles about people that nobody knows anything about. Insults get hurled in all directions and most people don't have sufficient knowledge of the individuals (or aren't sufficiently interested) to form an opinion on whether it's tripe or not. There are usually axes being ground somewhere in there. People are being "advised" to vote one way or another about a subject on which they have no knowledge.

There is usually a pitiful attempt at shaming, bullying and haranguing passive members into toeing the line, by calling them stupid or lazy if they don't immerse themselves arse-deep in the political ins and outs. History has shown that 9 times out of 10, all this radical change and reform doesn't make any appreciable difference at all.

As the song goes - "Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss" <_<

To use your favourite word on here........ COCK...!!

Did you vote??

What is so shameful about being involved in your sports association...??

How do you expect the member to put anything to a board that does not listen to the many calls that the proxy form was 'un safe'.

Why do you not read what has been put......is your attention span so small for the detail posted.

The proxy was stopped.....an EGM and a full review of the articles is going to take place including input of the members...... If you have no input then why post ceap here and slag off those who do have an interest in trying to make a difference.

I do not see any harranging of members........I see lots of information given here for members........or is it just that you think 'I' should not have a view.

Well tough....hell would freeze over first :smile:

Get engaged people.....do not be put of by the old dinasours of the sport......who like things just how they are.......and who like spouting forth on veiled attacks on those trying to do something about it.

 

[Westward]

Name calling.....Up yours Westy.......

I can assure you that i am very very handy with a horse and a lance.....

And the Spanish art of pig sticking.

I was born on a horse :smile:

Errrrmmm well I wasn't name calling it's just one of those things where writing and speaking differ. I should perhaps have said ' Think of Don Quixote'

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Errrrmmm well I wasn't name calling it's just one of those things where writing and speaking differ. I should perhaps have said ' Think of Don Quixote'

Yes and your inference was tilting at windmills.......At least have the conviction to be honest about your inferences.

Good grief ........ !!!

Late now for Spanish .....so I will be away for some time..!!

 

[Hotshot100]

We now have 6 months to get the CPSA's house in order. FACT!!

One thing that all members and non members should have in common is a love of our sport in its various forms.

An organisation such as the CPSA draws its members from many walks of life and with various reasons for joining.

I think that the main reason that many of our top shots don't get involved in the 'politics' is because they are members by necessity. They can not fulfill their aims and ambitions without being a member. I have heard it said by several of the 'names' in our sport that they are only members because they have to be.

Then there are those that like to shoot registered shoots on a regular basis, once again membership is mandatory

For both of these groups they are getting what they need from the CPSA and have no desire to get involved in 'politics'.which they don't understand.

Then there are the more casual shooters who make up the majority of our membership. They shoot the occasional registered competition, go to their local clubs on a Sunday morning and just enjoy their sport. Why do they join? For various reasons, insurance, Pull magazine, support from H.O. or because they feel that they are supporting the sport as a whole.

The majority of members don't want to be involved in the politics of the Association, they just want to shoot. I was not surprised with the number of proxies received, in fact I thought that it would be lower than 800.

Over the next 6 months there will hopefully be many questions on this forum and Nicola's blog relating to matters arising from the AGM. It would be great to think that these will all be answered politely and in a manner that might even get a few more members involved in their association.

 

[Chard]

To use your favourite word on here........ COCK...!!

Did you vote??

What is so shameful about being involved in your sports association...??

How do you expect the member to put anything to a board that does not listen to the many calls that the proxy form was 'un safe'.

Why do you not read what has been put......is your attention span so small for the detail posted.

The proxy was stopped.....an EGM and a full review of the articles is going to take place including input of the members...... If you have no input then why post ceap here and slag off those who do have an interest in trying to make a difference.

I do not see any harranging of members........I see lots of information given here for members........or is it just that you think 'I' should not have a view.

Well tough....hell would freeze over first :smile:

Get engaged people.....do not be put of by the old dinasours of the sport......who like things just how they are.......and who like spouting forth on veiled attacks on those trying to do something about it.

It isn't necessarily cock, just because you don't happen to agree with it.

No I didn't vote as I didn't understand a bit of what I was voting for and I don't vote for anything just because I'm told to. I also have a life outside clay shooting and have no intention of spending hours researching something when I am far from convinced that it will make any real difference.

If you can't see any haranguing, I would recommend a session with Ed Lyons.....

 

[Westward]

What is so shameful about being involved in your sports association...??

There's nothing shameful about being involved. What you seem to miss is that, equally, there's nothing shameful about NOT being involved.

For weeks now you have been haranguing everyone on here to go along with your wishes. Now you're asking "Did you vote??" of everyone whose opinion you don't like?

Whether or not someone voted and which way they voted is their business and their's alone.

Some things are worth fighting for, some aren't.

True story...

 

[Westward]

Yes and your inference was tilting at windmills.......

At least have the conviction to be honest about your inferences.

Good grief ........ !!!

Late now for Spanish .....so I will be away for some time..!!

Actually it was implication, inference is made by the reader. And yes I was being honest about it, hell it wasn't even subtle...

 

[Julesy]

I have been told today that the actual figure for votes cast was in fact just over 1100 , amazingly there were over 200 ballot forms voided.
I don't know why they were voided, perhaps someone on here might know.

 

[joe kitson]

i would just like to say a big thank you to nicola and husband and sara for the way they spoke at agm for all members for trying to make the cpsa a better organization for all including the i only wont to go shooing  dont wont to get involed its a good job these wernt about in 1939 to 1945 we would all been wearing black uniforms now come on people stick up for you sport and the future of your sport

 

[paulos]

i would just like to say a big thank you to nicola and husband and sara for the way they spoke at agm for all members for trying to make the cpsa a better organization for all including the i only wont to go shooing dont wont to get involed its a good job these wernt about in 1939 to 1945 we would all been wearing black uniforms now come on people stick up for you sport and the future of your sport

That's possibly the worst analogy I've ever heard. People have other commitments in life, shooting is something for their spare time. It can hardly be compared to the Second World War. Jesus H Christ.

 

[Lock Stock & Barrel]

I can agree with exhortations to get involved, but breaking Godwin's Law is unforgivable.

 

[ExSCA]

Not bad - it only took 60 thousand something posts to break Godwin.... impressed.

 

[Chard]

I'll be invading Poland after lunch...... :asciidity: