The AGM

[KR24]

Oh dear, Reductio ad Hitlerum.

Poor form Indeed.

 

[Salopian]

People,

 I think this is all getting childish and petty in many respects. Perhaps it is time to rethink our position.

The CPSA is the association charged with representing the sport of clay pigeon shooting in England, it is governed by a Board elected by the membership. The Board members have various reasons to become involved with the administration and governance of our sport, but should at all times inform and seek the advice of the membership, sadly this has been lacking for some time.

We now have an opportunity to put the association on the straight and narrow, and we should go ahead and do that, as long as procedure is followed and decisions are democratically made whether it is by 800 or 23,000 members I am fine with that.

As for those who have no interest in the running of the association, could I ask you a question?

Would you be bothered it the CPSA Board and management picked your pocket? I think you would.

So why you cannot be bothered when the Board waste money to the tune of £32,000 on legal action that could easily have been avoided and other obvious wastes of association funds  beats me.

If the association is going to go forward after this debacle, we need to put into place measures where the regions and membership guide the directors, NOT have misguided Directors dictating to the membership.

 

[johnyT]

I can agree with exhortations to get involved, but breaking Godwin's Law is unforgivable.

I think you'll find the post in question invoked Godwin's rather than broke it!

Does anyone else find it amusing the one who is always banging on about wasting CPSA money and rights etc is the one who some may well consider to be single handedly responsible for more of it going down the drain than any other reason in recent years.  Just saying.

 

[Jonathan Sargent]

This whole thread has gone down a reductio-ad-absurdum route...

No, I didn't vote.

I believe if I'd been alive in 1939 I'd have fought, however I wasn't do can't say for sure.

Loose my sport? By definition I may, at worst, loose CPSA competitions. I'll shoot world sporting, NSAA skeet, pigeons or hay balers.

Will me not voting cause my SGC to be taken - highly doubtful.

I am in CPSA to enter competitions, not to win cause I suck. To keep track of score and, critically, to benchmark against others. That's worth my 30 or 40 quid a year. It's not worth me giving up my time - it's not the central pillar of my life and if I lost it I wouldn't loose sleep. My time is, instead, invested in my daughter and my job.

To keep my SGC I invest my money in BASC (yep - 2 memberships). I entrust BASC to fight my political battles and keep my SGC valid for me. If they email and ask me to fill in an online form or send an email I will. They ask the right way and a response is minimal time.

If CPSA want a better uptake on votes, email me - Why followed by What - and make a response easy. Nice online form will do.

If I knew everything that had gone on would I have voted - no idea, like many on this thread I still don't know what's gone on.

Have I noticed a difference in my life? No - fees haven't gone up enough to hit my pocket and the clay ground still runs on a Sunday and benchmarking tools are still online.

There are many different people in this world, none right, none wrong. Some will do politics and some won't. I've never complained about the CPSA so don't feel I need to get involved. For those involved in the political process, thank you. However, if it causes you stress and you don't feel the end result is worthwhile please stop.

If it is worthwhile - great, keep going. But not everybody will place the same value on the outcomes as you or have the same perception as you. Making me feel attacked because I didn't vote isn't right - accepting that 97% didn't vote and wondering why is fine. Try the BASC way, embrace the digital age, email me, accept I never go near a post box and I live in a modern world - minimal time inputs for everything, not because the world got lazy but because its possible.

 

[Chard]

I think you'll find the post in question invoked Godwin's rather than broke it!

Does anyone else find it amusing the one who is always banging on about wasting CPSA money and rights etc is the one who some may well consider to be single handedly responsible for more of it going down the drain than any other reason in recent years.  Just saying.

 

[timps]

Quite a few seem to think that not voting means not interested, or are not allowed a view, in my case I was interested. However I had grave misgivings on the incumbent chairman but unfortunately I had misgivings for the challenger as well. I am not too sure someone who does not follow through his convictions and feels the need for an apology just because someone robustly express their views is cut out for the rigors of chairmanship.

The 2nd issue did concern me but seeing as in my opinion the whole of the CPSA articles were useless I was never going to use my proxy as I was never going to find impartial information to sway my vote one way or another.

If the vote had been do I want  a review of the CPSA Articles of Association then I would have voted, but it wasn’t. It was for me do you want a chairman where neither candidates inspire you and do you want to keep a vote that I was never going to use.

Send a proxy out on the use of steel shot, fibre wad or 21 grams only and see how many replies you get back then.

If the candidates for chairman engage with me via pull, website, facebook, email  etc. I will choose one and vote, for this AGM I had a biased CPSA view and partisan forum members hence why I did not vote.

Whoever is chairman I will still be shooting CPSA registered events, if one candidate was making me reconsider that fact then I would be very proactive. 

 

[Michael]

i would just like to say a big thank you to nicola and husband and sara for the way they spoke at agm for all members for trying to make the cpsa a better organization for all including the i only wont to go shooing  dont wont to get involed its a good job these wernt about in 1939 to 1945 we would all been wearing black uniforms now come on people stick up for you sport and the future of your sport

To bring 1939/45 into this argument is disgraceful. If you really think there is any comparison between a CPSA internal disagreement and a World War you should be ashamed.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

I think you'll find the post in question invoked Godwin's rather than broke it!

Does anyone else find it amusing the one who is always banging on about wasting CPSA money and rights etc is the one who some may well consider to be single handedly responsible for more of it going down the drain than any other reason in recent years. Just saying.

State your point clearly ...! Who exactly are you talking about and why. I hope you are going to give an accurately informed answer.
The same goes for Chard...!

 

[Chard]

State your point clearly ...! Who exactly are you talking about and why. I hope you are going to give an accurately informed answer.

The same goes for Chard...!

Is that a threat?

 

[ehb102]

The Board members have various reasons to become involved with the administration and governance of our sport, but should at all times inform and seek the advice of the membership, sadly this has been lacking for some time.

Is that your opinion or is it written in the articles? Some people think that the time to talk to the electorate is before the election. After the election they consider the electorate spoken with and that the electorate trusts them to do what they see fit to represent them. If you don't like it, you can elect someone else next time.

As for those who have no interest in the running of the association, could I ask you a question?

Would you be bothered it the CPSA Board and management picked your pocket? I think you would.

So why you cannot be bothered when the Board waste money to the tune of £32,000 on legal action that could easily have been avoided and other obvious wastes of association funds  beats me.

£32,000 is less than £1.50 per member and way less than what it would have cost me to get to Swindon. So they've done me out of £1.50 and I've saved a day.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Is that a threat?

Why should it be considered a threat from me.......I do not care what he says about other people.....I am issuing caution just like i do on all threads that are straying into danger.

He has not made clear yet who he is talking about.......but one should always be very careful on a world wide web not to get involved in something that you do not have the facts for ........for instance....do you know what John Taylor is talking about? Or who he is talking about? Please enlighten us if you do.

If you were just being your 'controversial self' by posting your lemon face...can you explain to us all what it signifies, then we al know what 'you' are trying to say?

It is very simple.

p.s. You would clearly know if I issued a threat......just saying.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Do you think people that those interested in the subject can continue to discuss without the 'ever so amusing' additions from those who do not bother one hoot about the subject matter.....and it seems whose only enjoyment is to take threads off-line??

If we cannot discuss the matter in Pull magazine or the CPSA website....where else do you think that shooters from all over the country can discuss it.....yes of course on the shooting forums.....the last free place to air a view. (If it was kept on-line rather than being taken off topic by 'personalities' who are self-professed .....not interested).

 

[Chard]

Why should it be considered a threat from me.......I do not care what he says about other people.....I am issuing caution just like i do on all threads that are straying into danger.

He has not made clear yet who he is talking about.......but one should always be very careful on a world wide web not to get involved in something that you do not have the facts for ........for instance....do you know what John Taylor is talking about? Or who he is talking about? Please enlighten us if you do.

If you were just being your 'controversial self' by posting your lemon face...can you explain to us all what it signifies, then we al know what 'you' are trying to say?

It is very simple.

p.s. You would clearly know if I issued a threat......just saying.

I wasn't asking if you were threatening JohnnyT.

By posting silly pictures of Kenneth Williams and his gloriously expressive face, I was attempting to lighten what is becoming a tedious, overly heavy and unpleasant stack of sh*te which is rapidly escalating out of control.

Other people are entitled to an opinion and at the end of the day, most view this whole sorry saga as a pointless sideshow.

They didn't vote because they didn't want to vote and it wasn't compulsory last time I checked.

 

[joe kitson]

for those who are offended by my comment on 1939 1945 if i have upset you i apologize but i think you are missing the point i was trying to point out if you dont fight for you rights you will loose them  you are the one i see on shooting grounds every week moaning and groning about the cpsa but wont do anything about it just keep sitting on the fence letting others fight your battle/s but won/t to rep the benerfits 

 

[** Pending Removal **]

I wasn't asking if you were threatening JohnnyT.

By posting silly pictures of Kenneth Williams and his gloriously expressive face, I was attempting to lighten what is becoming a tedious, overly heavy and unpleasant stack of sh*te which is rapidly escalating out of control.

Other people are entitled to an opinion and at the end of the day, most view this whole sorry saga as a pointless sideshow.

They didn't vote because they didn't want to vote and it wasn't compulsory last time I checked.

As I said clearly.......youor anyone would know 'very clearly' if i ever gave out a threat. 

JT has made comment about someone without clarifying who or details of what..........................I asked for clarification.................from both of you, as you copied his quote.

However if you do not know what he is talking about, you cannot help us.....but i am sure that everyone loved your little picture as much as I did :smile:

 

[timps]

for those who are offended by my comment on 1939 1945 if i have upset you i apologize but i think you are missing the point i was trying to point out if you dont fight for you rights you will loose them  you are the one i see on shooting grounds every week moaning and groning about the cpsa but wont do anything about it just keep sitting on the fence letting others fight your battle/s but won/t to rep the benerfits 

But that’s the issue, is the new prospective chairman going to do anything about my moans and groans?

I have no idea what he is going to change or achieve and he has no idea of my moans and groans.

The apathy exists because of the way the CPSA chooses it’s chairman, what has come out of this is hopefully a change to that process, but this change was never on the table for voting  hence why I suspect many did not vote.

 

[Westward]

for those who are offended by my comment on 1939 1945 if i have upset you i apologize but i think you are missing the point i was trying to point out if you dont fight for you rights you will loose them  you are the one i see on shooting grounds every week moaning and groning about the cpsa but wont do anything about it just keep sitting on the fence letting others fight your battle/s but won/t to rep the benerfits 

I can only repeat myself: "Some things are worth fighting for, some aren't".

I tend to get annoyed when people try to inflict their agenda onto all around them by alternately bullying and cajoling followed by childish attempts at shaming those who've got other things in their lives or who have other priorities.

Rest assured I have & I will fight for my rights where it matters, but I'm entirely happy to leave the scrutinising of every last detail of the way the CPSA is run to the 3 or 4 people on here who seem to relish that sort of thing.

 

[** Pending Removal **]

But that’s the issue, is the new prospective chairman going to do anything about my moans and groans?

I have no idea what he is going to change or achieve and he has no idea of my moans and groans.

The apathy exists because of the way the CPSA chooses it’s chairman, what has come out of this is hopefully a change to that process, but this change was never on the table for voting  hence why I suspect many did not vote.

I agree Timps...... but as was explained in great detail on various threads....the problem this year was the type of proxy form that was issued in Pull....being 'unsafe'.

Thankfully now due to the deliberations and discussions on the day, everyone voted to not use it and to address with a matter of urgency the Articles which protect us all....and bring them up to date including the way to vote for a Chairman as part of it. This should at least let those who are interested, have information on those available.

Some on here have accused me of harranging.....but all the many people who sent me PM's and emails asking for an explanation of the facts so that they could make up their minds would disagree with that as many have thanked me for taking the time to explain.

There has not been any harranging.......but there has been plenty of 'pleading' for people to get informed with the subject matter, plenty of 'pleading' for people to be bothered about what goes on in their association and plenty of 'pleading' for people to use their vote either one way or another. Not once have i asked anyone to vote in a particular way.

Equally i have no idea why the 'usual suspects' always try to take any subject i post...off-line ....or force it into a personal attack. I do not know ......and i am not interested in what their agendas are. 

And they certainly will not by their snidey remarks , knock me off course. I have always spoken up for what is right, I have always spoke out against wasted monies, and you know what.....I will continue to do so.....

Get used to it Girls....!

:smile:

 

[** Pending Removal **]

I can only repeat myself: "Some things are worth fighting for, some aren't".

I tend to get annoyed when people try to inflict their agenda onto all around them by alternately bullying and cajoling followed by childish attempts at shaming those who've got other things in their lives or who have other priorities.

Rest assured I have & I will fight for my rights where it matters, but I'm entirely happy to leave the scrutinising of every last detail of the way the CPSA is run to the 3 or 4 people on here who seem to relish that sort of thing.

I suspect you have no idea what your rights are....or how to fight your way out of a paper bag after reading some of the confused comments on threads over the many months. However you are good at misreading anyone's intentions who are serious about the sport.....and i do not think that you read or take in any of the detailed technical issues.....maybe you proof read it ....who knows ,,,,,who cares.....but you always seem to get the complete wrong end of the stick with me.....even if i speak Lancastrian. 

You have already professed many times that you are not interested.....so why keep chipping in with negatives....when others (me included) are trying for the positives).

 

[Chard]

I agree Timps...... but as was explained in great detail on various threads....the problem this year was the type of proxy form that was issued in Pull....being 'unsafe'.

Thankfully now due to the deliberations and discussions on the day, everyone voted to not use it and to address with a matter of urgency the Articles which protect us all....and bring them up to date including the way to vote for a Chairman as part of it. This should at least let those who are interested, have information on those available.

Some on here have accused me of harranging.....but all the many people who sent me PM's and emails asking for an explanation of the facts so that they could make up their minds would disagree with that as many have thanked me for taking the time to explain.

There has not been any harranging.......but there has been plenty of 'pleading' for people to get informed with the subject matter, plenty of 'pleading' for people to be bothered about what goes on in their association and plenty of 'pleading' for people to use their vote either one way or another. Not once have i asked anyone to vote in a particular way.

Equally i have no idea why the 'usual suspects' always try to take any subject i post...off-line ....or force it into a personal attack. I do not know ......and i am not interested in what their agendas are. 

And they certainly will not by their snidey remarks , knock me off course. I have always spoken up for what is right, I have always spoke out against wasted monies, and you know what.....I will continue to do so.....

Get used to it Girls....!

:smile:

*haranguing :spiteful: