the dreaded straight bird..........

[dyosk]

Just got back from OT practise, wide birds all breaking really well. The straight birds however were another matter.

Are there any drills to help with these.....think I might have to keep no birding the straight bird 25 times to practise ?

I think my sight picture must be all wrong and I'm shooting too close to them as they rise.

Any thoughts or is it a questioonnof keep practising them as they appear in a round? Even thought about shooting DTL to get me used to shooting straight away birds ?

Thanks

 

[jwpzx9r]

3 things

1 Are the straight ? Not even 5 - 10 degrees?

2 Are you keeping your gun moving?

Are you lifting your head to get a look at them?

all of the above are a miss if you get them wrong. I am new to the game someone with far more knowledge than me will be along shortly to get you on track.

 

[ips]

Well let us simplify it. You are either above or under the target, do you know which ?

Does your gun shoot high or flat ?

If you can tell us both or even one of the above we have a starting point.

 

[ips]

Ps, all of johns points are valid.

Pps, Dtl will not help you as the speed is so different in fact if you are serious about fast trap disciplines Dtl could do a heap of trouble.

Ppps, there are many things it could be and its difficult to help without seeing you shoot but give us as much info as you can and we will give it a good go.

Edit to my 1st reply,

what gun, flat or high rib

 

[jwpzx9r]

Reason I asked is it straight away is sometime they look straight away but are 5 or 10 you have been seeing clays fly of at 20 - 45 right and left then suddenly great a straight away except it isn't and at the speed they are traveling if you don't get out side it you have missed to one side or the other.

 

[ips]

Very true john, the current scheme we have on at our practice ground has a straight high target from peg 4 except its not straight its a few degrees right and as you say your brain tells you its straight. I found this out today thankfully second barrel sorted it but only when i pulled the gun right.

One of many reasons to miss but i would like more info from the op. Would also like clarification of are we taking straight low or any straight.

Either way from my experience its probably a miss below due to not attacking the sub consciously assumed easy target. Push through the target / follow through will sort this out. This is why i asked if the op had or thought he had a high shooting poi as this makes one subconsciously afraid to push through the target.

 

[jwpzx9r]

Low straight are a puzzling bird too Ian. I think there is a reluctance to keep the gun moving for fear of a miss above. I try to get it shot quick while the gun is still swinging up, if you don't get it early you are faced with a falling bird second barrel hate them never get under them enough!

 

[ips]

Exactly john its low but still climbing so shoot front edge same as every other target.

 

[dyosk]

Not being straight is a good point. Gun is a high rib that shoots a little. I think I shoot over them moving the too close compared to the angled birds which I shoot comfortably.

Haven't shot DTL in years, but it just struck me it might slow me down on the straight ones.

As the clays are slower and straighter.

Its the one target I find I shoot better if I do think much slower. By straight I mean the steep and flat straightish ones. Not sure which scheme wssd on today.

I don't think I move my head at all but I ask someone to watch me and see.

This is why its fun though isn't it...!

 

[ips]

Ok so high rib gun. Ordinarily i would say you would be missing under however with a high rib you may be right and your over possibly because your target acquisition is earlier due to the better vision offered by a high rib therefore your moving to early. Only a theory of course. You could try a lower gun hold but i Spose that defeats the object of high rib so probably your going to have to just hold back on the shot. Personally, apart from a few people who can, i believe that a high rib is far from suited to fast trap.

As i say this is only a theory not having seen you shoot but that's my best educated guess at this stage.

The other theory is the original one of not committing to the shot and shooting under. Your going to have to try both theorys to find out but of course both could be wrong.

 

[jake.keeling]

The way it was described to me, by a good coach, was that if you imagine a box or window above the trap house roof, and you are following the let it out type of shooting plan, which is correct. Then a straight target will stay within that box for longer than a hard angle, causing you to jump all over it and produce misses in all the above descriptions.


http://www.tirovesti.co.uk/

 

[40UP]

David isn't getting these second barrel as he would if he was under them - just lifting a bit more into them. So I'd recommend keeping the focal point and lowering the gun hold till it works watching for detriment to the angled targets with this compromise. There is very little visual input on straight targets - little face and not as much movement as angled targets. Don't keep no-birding it as that removes the surprise element and is unfair to the ground owner - unless you have a prior arrangement your feet might not touch the ground.

 

[ips]

Fred, i do not dispute what you say but surely its possible to miss below with both barrels ?

A not fully committed shot to any target, but from my experience particularly low straight, is a miss below for sure.

Just my opinion.

 

[miroukumk38]

If your an experienced shot you should know if you have shot below it, sight picture equals seeing a gap rather than bead on clay then usually get it 2nd barrell, if you don't know where your missing i'd say you either over the top which is very easy to do especially after a coulple of high birds ie seeing it bit of a jerk and your ott, or as said previously if its a 5 degree angle could be shooting up the side of them.

 

[40UP]

If you can, watch another squad shoot 'your' layout and instead of watching the targets sail away note the exit point of the five centre traps. Almost all grounds put the marker over the centre trap not the centre target. The exit point will usually be to the right as almost all traps are right handed except some Mattarelli.

FdT

 

[Les53]

If you can, watch another squad shoot 'your' layout and instead of watching the targets sail away note the exit point of the five centre traps. Almost all grounds put the marker over the centre trap not the centre target. The exit point will usually be to the right as almost all traps are right handed except some Mattarelli.

FdT

What Fred said,but I would also add that some people,including me at times,don't actually attack that target as it often looks so flat! As we know though it is not flat at all,so a lack of gun speed/movement will cause a miss under, its common enough and some think they miss over! I had a real issue with such targets at one time, so had a lesson with Pete Croft,problem sorted.......most of the time!!!

 

[philpot]

Intersting Les. I was having the same issue recently on returning back to clay bustin. I short session with Hamish at Beverley and I now have the muzzles just below the trench and my viewing point about 30' out in front of the trench which I guess is maybe 6-7' above the trap. This has now made me SEE the target properly before pulling the trigger. I don't find that I am shooting much slower and in fact it has helped on all the other angles because I am shooting at the bird rather than shooting where I  think it should go.

Difficult to explain but that fraction of a second longer to see the target and bring the gun up is putting me on the target much more accurately.

I hope that makes sense.

Phil

 

[Andrew.Addison]

Generally on all targets if you are off the mark as soon as you call pull you are reacting to nothing more than the flash of the target. There "should" be a momentary pause from pull to shot and by momentary I mean milliseconds as most shots are completed under 1 second usually in the 0.7 - 0.8th of a second range. That momentary pause will allow your eyes to see the target, lock onto it, then in the blink of an eye your sub conscious will have done all of its magical mental calculations and you will have moved and taken the shot. 

Giving yourself that tiny bit of time to really SEE the target is the difference between a hit and a miss, and it applies to all targets since you won't know what your getting until you SEE it coming out of the trap house. 

As for hold points mine varies from ground to ground.  Sometimes I will be on the mark and sometimes I can be as far as the back edge of the trap house, it all depends on lighting, how well I am seeing the targets on the day and how I perceive the targets coming out of the house. 

 

[Les53]

Generally on all targets if you are off the mark as soon as you call pull you are reacting to nothing more than the flash of the target. There "should" be a momentary pause from pull to shot and by momentary I mean milliseconds as most shots are completed under 1 second usually in the 0.7 - 0.8th of a second range. That momentary pause will allow your eyes to see the target, lock onto it, then in the blink of an eye your sub conscious will have done all of its magical mental calculations and you will have moved and taken the shot. 

Giving yourself that tiny bit of time to really SEE the target is the difference between a hit and a miss, and it applies to all targets since you won't know what your getting until you SEE it coming out of the trap house. 

As for hold points mine varies from ground to ground.  Sometimes I will be on the mark and sometimes I can be as far as the back edge of the trap house, it all depends on lighting, how well I am seeing the targets on the day and how I perceive the targets coming out of the house. 

Very well said mate!