jim french
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Dubai Tournament
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Irishgunner
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I think if digweed had have made the final and 4 birds down he would have won it, no one can take pressure like George, I really wanted him to win this one, next year I hope
Clynt
Well-known member
Looking at the scores, one could easily assume a lot of our top shots were not ready for those type of targets ? was it due to the target quality we see week in week out ? well it def did not help
I think many will be a lot nearer the mark next time, they may not get the practise on this type of target at reg shoots but I am sure they all know what has to be done.
This shoot was provided by a man, whose wealth is unimaginable, only succumbed by his generosity. so I feel it is only respectful to give it your best while there, by this I mean being ready for the big gaps and long targets, where and when you can do that here ? under competition conditions who knows ? practise may not be enough on its own so maybe there should be a higher standard of speed and distance and some shoots, they could be labeled as such when advertised ?
Do we need to up it at majors, ?? there seems to be a fine line at the moment in the sport between those who want a test and those who want a big score ? dont think both are achievable for the majority ....do you stay in the "keep everybody happy zone" or stretch out and see what can be done to up the anti, the classes are there for a reason so it may be wise for each county to hold a "pro" shoot annually to test the best , it would make sense if there was 1 each month somewhere so the top boys could compete in the required element .
doubt much will change at the majors this year !! I think its time to dig out my passport, shorts,and sun hat... you gotta want some of that as a shooter of any level
I think many will be a lot nearer the mark next time, they may not get the practise on this type of target at reg shoots but I am sure they all know what has to be done.
This shoot was provided by a man, whose wealth is unimaginable, only succumbed by his generosity. so I feel it is only respectful to give it your best while there, by this I mean being ready for the big gaps and long targets, where and when you can do that here ? under competition conditions who knows ? practise may not be enough on its own so maybe there should be a higher standard of speed and distance and some shoots, they could be labeled as such when advertised ?
Do we need to up it at majors, ?? there seems to be a fine line at the moment in the sport between those who want a test and those who want a big score ? dont think both are achievable for the majority ....do you stay in the "keep everybody happy zone" or stretch out and see what can be done to up the anti, the classes are there for a reason so it may be wise for each county to hold a "pro" shoot annually to test the best , it would make sense if there was 1 each month somewhere so the top boys could compete in the required element .
doubt much will change at the majors this year !! I think its time to dig out my passport, shorts,and sun hat... you gotta want some of that as a shooter of any level
chubby
Well-known member
The problem is that when we pushed out the targets 50% said they would not come again as they did not enjoy it. we then had to give discounts to get people back so as a business most would go gentle.
shootinguru
Well-known member
Chubby, I have never seen anyone leave after the first day of a Fiasc selection shoot be cause the targets were too soft!
I have over the years seen lots not come back the second day because the target setters/grounds pee'd off the shooters! with stupid targets :fie:
I have over the years seen lots not come back the second day because the target setters/grounds pee'd off the shooters! with stupid targets :fie:
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chubby
Well-known member
Cyril that's what I meant to hard and they complain. But no complaints in Dubai so why not?
Because Dubai wasn't Fitasc as it's meant to be, no averages were under threat for a start and as some keep saying it was a mega event bringing shooters from across the world to a tiny kingdom for the hosts own reasons and with such lavish prizes and ambience that could only be dreamed of elsewhere. The winner is always he/she who hits most regardless of distance.
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shootinguru
Well-known member
Chubby, when you at W. London keep you ear to the ground its supprising what you may hear?
!. The prize money winners are all going to say this was the best targets ever!
2. shooters like Ben R.F. R. King, Andy Moon and John Pool are not going to say anything detrimental on this wesite its bad policy and they want to be Mr Nice Guy.
3. No one wants to be the first shooter to say it was not good fitasc because no one wants to be the villain!
4. The wannabees that shot 5 or 6 a layout wouldent know a good fitasc target if it hit them in the head! :crazy:
!. The prize money winners are all going to say this was the best targets ever!
2. shooters like Ben R.F. R. King, Andy Moon and John Pool are not going to say anything detrimental on this wesite its bad policy and they want to be Mr Nice Guy.
3. No one wants to be the first shooter to say it was not good fitasc because no one wants to be the villain!
4. The wannabees that shot 5 or 6 a layout wouldent know a good fitasc target if it hit them in the head! :crazy:
Clynt
Well-known member
Surely it's about knowing what to expect ? if you enter for a nice jolly day out then targets are immaterial somewhat ...but if you enter as a competitor and the targets are similar for everyone, does it matter that it gets won with 82.5% ? realistic relevance to target severity , may dent your pride and may not look good on your averages ...so what ! enjoy the new challenge , don't think you will get too much moaning from the boys and girls who went , more over hopefully they enjoyed it ?
teepee1234
Well-known member
Shootinguru, the arrogant disdain that you constantly show for the general shooter is really becoming quite tedious. Just in case you aren't aware, an awful lot of your posts come over as arrogant, belittling and downright offensive. Maybe you should offer your obviously massive knowledge and experience to the Sheik next year to ensure it's a resounding success, because you seem to think this year's was a failure.
With your obvious knowledge and experience, wouldn't it be better to see encouragement, assistance and advice from you? Instead, we get "wannabees" and "so called experts" all the time. It's unrelenting, and hugely offensive in anyone's language. Everyone has to start somewhere, but you seem to be suggesting that unless we're in the top echelons of shooting, we shouldn't enter major competitions.
Number 4 on your post 706 - what on earth is that all about? A few of us went to Konopiste last year for the Europeans, more went to Madrid for the Worlds. No-one had any delusions of winning anything. We went for the experience and a mini holiday with friends. That's exactly why most people went to Dubai. Why is that wrong? What is it about you that you seem to have become bitter and twisted, and look down your nose at most shooters? Or have you always been this way? I'm now beginning to feel pity, rather than annoyance. It's making me sad.
With your obvious knowledge and experience, wouldn't it be better to see encouragement, assistance and advice from you? Instead, we get "wannabees" and "so called experts" all the time. It's unrelenting, and hugely offensive in anyone's language. Everyone has to start somewhere, but you seem to be suggesting that unless we're in the top echelons of shooting, we shouldn't enter major competitions.
Number 4 on your post 706 - what on earth is that all about? A few of us went to Konopiste last year for the Europeans, more went to Madrid for the Worlds. No-one had any delusions of winning anything. We went for the experience and a mini holiday with friends. That's exactly why most people went to Dubai. Why is that wrong? What is it about you that you seem to have become bitter and twisted, and look down your nose at most shooters? Or have you always been this way? I'm now beginning to feel pity, rather than annoyance. It's making me sad.
Shootinguru,
I am told that you are a knowledgable person and as such people such as myself, relatively new to shooting and eager to learn and hear about how things work in the shooting world look to people like you for knowledge not just about how things are now but how they were in the past. It would help me to respect your views, ideas, knowledge if you would just refrain from calling what is the majority of shooters as "wannabees". This is a derogatory term and just alienates me and I am sure many others.
You could make me feel as if I do not have anything of worth to offer to discussions because of my relative newness, that I would have to have been in the shooting world 40+ years before I should be taken seriously. Just so you know, had I an interest in fitasc or rather had it been ESP in Dubai and had I had the money this year to have entered I would have. No chance of winning or coming anywhere but at the bottom for me I know that from the outset but what a fantastic all round experience they have had out there and I am sure I would have loved it.
Declaring those who only hit 5 or 6 targets on a layout as not knowing what a fitasc target should look like is a ridiculous statement unless of course you have undertaken a survey of those people and given them a test on the subject. Plus I notice our own renowned and well respected Beckie McKenzie managed 7 on one of her layouts - does she come into this category or does the extra target save her from your disrespectful rantings?
I am told that you are a knowledgable person and as such people such as myself, relatively new to shooting and eager to learn and hear about how things work in the shooting world look to people like you for knowledge not just about how things are now but how they were in the past. It would help me to respect your views, ideas, knowledge if you would just refrain from calling what is the majority of shooters as "wannabees". This is a derogatory term and just alienates me and I am sure many others.
You could make me feel as if I do not have anything of worth to offer to discussions because of my relative newness, that I would have to have been in the shooting world 40+ years before I should be taken seriously. Just so you know, had I an interest in fitasc or rather had it been ESP in Dubai and had I had the money this year to have entered I would have. No chance of winning or coming anywhere but at the bottom for me I know that from the outset but what a fantastic all round experience they have had out there and I am sure I would have loved it.
Declaring those who only hit 5 or 6 targets on a layout as not knowing what a fitasc target should look like is a ridiculous statement unless of course you have undertaken a survey of those people and given them a test on the subject. Plus I notice our own renowned and well respected Beckie McKenzie managed 7 on one of her layouts - does she come into this category or does the extra target save her from your disrespectful rantings?
Will Hewland
Well-known member
I actually thought Cyril's post was a good one, as I quite like to hear it like it is. Even a bit of cynicism is ok in my book. Then I read point 4 and did feel he had spoiled it..
Hoop
Active member
I know that Team USA does lots of fundraising with raffles e.g. carts (because we are fat americans who cannot calculate odds, myself included) guns (because we are gun nuts) and entries into big shoots like the US Open or our Nationals (because we like to shoot s#*t). Also some, not everyone but some, of our US shooters make contributions to the team so we can send our shooters abroad to certain shoots, not this one however. I don't golf, play the ponies, or grunt loudly on a tennis court, I shoot. So I give money to my national team. I also take lessons from Mattarese when I can afford it (very proud of him). As far as I know that is how our team USA men and women are funded. Plus, they cover a lot of their own costs.
As for Dubai, next year your top, or really all shooters, are going to be very very hard to beat. They now know what they can expect. There is a you tube video of GD shooting birds where he misses one (while talking) and after the miss he stares down the bird with a look that should have been felt by every pigeon, dove and song bird within 400 miles. I reckon he is coming back to Dubai with that look.
As for Dubai, next year your top, or really all shooters, are going to be very very hard to beat. They now know what they can expect. There is a you tube video of GD shooting birds where he misses one (while talking) and after the miss he stares down the bird with a look that should have been felt by every pigeon, dove and song bird within 400 miles. I reckon he is coming back to Dubai with that look.
I think we missed matts point in an earlier post if the final was a scratch start the two eng shooter would have been 1st and joint 3rd! Not taking anything away from gebben and the other finalists .......just saying
www.proshock.co.uk
www.proshock.co.uk
Jim Wheeler
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- Jan 11, 2014
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lots of emotional comments flying! breath in ,, exhale!. hahaa.
FSP has softened considerably over the years, currently a score of 190+ is a winner, 10 years ago it was 170ish''. so,, it was a tough shoot! like the old days, In fact, I think we all have the common sense to understand why on this shoot, and not for a moment will it put people off competing in the future.the whole question of scores etc has been discussed very recently, perhaps the organizers will have the forsight(?) to include a class system,to share it out a bit? dunno how THAT might work though,,sandbaggers beware :crazy: hehe,, certainly do not need negative input to this shoot,,, the sport badly needs this,,if its good for darts, pool,, pigeon racing, etc, it shoud be good for shooting!,as it is there is worldwide resistance to shooting sports, encouraged by various governments, and anti gun lobbies,,, but we don't need to go there at the moment! suffice that a lot of good coverage is good for the sport.
FSP has softened considerably over the years, currently a score of 190+ is a winner, 10 years ago it was 170ish''. so,, it was a tough shoot! like the old days, In fact, I think we all have the common sense to understand why on this shoot, and not for a moment will it put people off competing in the future.the whole question of scores etc has been discussed very recently, perhaps the organizers will have the forsight(?) to include a class system,to share it out a bit? dunno how THAT might work though,,sandbaggers beware :crazy: hehe,, certainly do not need negative input to this shoot,,, the sport badly needs this,,if its good for darts, pool,, pigeon racing, etc, it shoud be good for shooting!,as it is there is worldwide resistance to shooting sports, encouraged by various governments, and anti gun lobbies,,, but we don't need to go there at the moment! suffice that a lot of good coverage is good for the sport.
Hoop
Active member
For that kind of prize I think that all the targets should count. I saw a state shoot where there was "final" on Saturday afternoon (while the shooting went into Sunday) to increase viewers, and one shooter won the final and one broke more targets, I thought it was BS, frankly. A good example is what happened to Faulds at the Nationals here. He broke more targets he was the winner.
No no nooooooooo please no, this format worked because only the stars deserve big money, I have long said even your average comps ought to only payout to the top 5-10 highest scorers because it's the first step towards being taken seriously as well as a per op er jolt for the lower classes to up their game.
I don't mind spending two grand and seeing talent walk off with the loot but I'd be devastated to shoot a 140 and watch a 110 walk away with a $20,000 cheque and a grin.
I don't mind spending two grand and seeing talent walk off with the loot but I'd be devastated to shoot a 140 and watch a 110 walk away with a $20,000 cheque and a grin.
Jim Wheeler
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Hamster,, you have a very valid point!,,, I also don't fancy shooting a 140, and some one gives me the finger as he banks 10k! BUT,,,then shooting becomes elitist, not unlike most sports where the average Jo is a spectator. we need participation of all shooters,,how to do that in a sport where ability is the ONLY criteria? ability comes from practice,,which comes from money,,,not like buying a dartboard,,,as you know! so I dunno, on one hand ,we desperately need this $$$ format,, but also need to attract and keep the majority of shooters who shoot a 100 a month . without the interest from a big participation,,the sport will die.
